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[Music]

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congratulations youtube

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you did it you wore me down and you

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sucked me back

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in i have too many subscribers here just

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to walk away entirely

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especially with no alternative that

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truly stacks up and so many copycat

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channels uploading my shows for me

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anyway

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but we can't forget the thc's account

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here is on thin ice

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and so the youtube version of the show

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has to be prefaced with this little psa

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only to say that episodes that contain

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the kinds of themes that have been

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regularly banned on youtube

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will not appear here and even with that

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precaution

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there's already enough in the archive to

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get us removed so remember that the

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higher side chats could be banned or put

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in time out again

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at any time and i won't be able to tell

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you guys about it

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so if you feel like it's been too long

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since you've heard from me here on this

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digital dystopian draconian data mining

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monster of a police state seeking

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platform

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your first step should be to check the

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hiresightchats.com for the latest shows

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alright alright enjoy

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to another free first hour episode of

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the higher side chats

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i know we want to get into the action

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but i have to ask that you help me armor

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us up a bit for the bumpy road ahead

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because i bring you the first hour of

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this show without unrelated ad nonsense

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as a proof of concept and if you value

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it then come over to thc plus for the

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eight dollars a month and hear the full

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two hour interviews as they were

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designed to be and as you would enjoy

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them most

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go to thehiresidechats.com or just click

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the link in the show notes to get

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started and within a minute you'll be

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plugging in your new plus show rss feed

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into a hopefully decentralized

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podcasting 2.0 supported app

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feed the things you want to grow and

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starve the things that gotta go and we

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will reach the promised land

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in the 1930s president franklin delano

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roosevelt addressed the nation through a

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series of radio broadcasts known as the

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fireside

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chats his aim was to reassure the common

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man that our society would recover from

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its troubled times

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well we're far from 1930 and i deal with

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a different

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kind of fire for a new era of worldly

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frustration we offer a fresh

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conversation

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i'm greg carlwood and these are the

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higher side chats

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all right higher sight chatter from

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sunny san diego i'm greg carlwood

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and just beyond the soapboxing

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politicians and bright flashy busyness

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of modern life

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is a subtle world of mystery and myth

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that struggles to be seen yet alone

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understood by modern man

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and a culture that's as preoccupied with

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digital screens as it is desperate to

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restore meaning from its current shallow

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state

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today encounters with the anomalous are

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written off as mistaken identity

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stories made up by attention seekers or

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some cable network

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money grab but nearly every culture

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outside of our arrogant own has a place

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for spirit

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myth imagination and beings between the

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worlds

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from elves fairies and bigfoot to lake

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monsters sea

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serpents in the siren we have a very

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long history of strange sightings

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stories and encounters with entities

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unexplainable by materialist context

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but we dare not change the model and

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despite our disbelief these things don't

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go away

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but some say actually shift form to

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reflect the changing times or command

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attention

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in a distracted world but try as they

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might even mothman grey aliens and men

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in black still struggle to get a seat at

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the table of our awareness

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well that's what today's guests are here

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to correct as they've studied the old

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ways of the greek philosophers and other

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cultures who map these realities

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we're both raised in a family that kept

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the door to spirit wide open

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and have written great books to help the

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rest of us get back on track

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you might remember patrick harper from

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an interview we did in 2018 covering his

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books demonic reality a field guide to

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the other world

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the secret tradition of the soul and the

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philosopher's secret fire

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and as great as it is to have him back

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today we're also joined by his sister

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merrily harper who's recently released a

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revised and updated edition of her book

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mystery big cats a very thorough expose

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on one particular type of demonic

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manifestation that she says is now the

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commonest encounter with the unknown in

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britain

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after reading her book i am very psyched

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to get into it so let's do it the

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dynamic duo from dorset restoring the

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demonic reality for a culture lost

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merrily and patrick harper welcome to

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the higher side

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thank you greg thank you greg i like

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dynamic duo from dorset yes

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very good flow to that yeah you know i

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still get people saying that of the

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interviews and episodes i've done that

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explore the paranormal side of life

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and explain the structure of all of that

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yours is a real standout so it's great

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to have you

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back on board for this and merrily it is

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a pleasure to meet you as well

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when patrick told me about your book

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mystery big cats

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i was interested but just wasn't quite

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sure

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that we could build a full show around

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it because

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even if what are called anomalous big

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cats abcs

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are more than just undiscovered animals

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they obviously

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resemble known animals so they don't

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have the epic

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punch as something like mothman or the

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chupacabra

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or fairies that talk to people or take

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them underground even and we have all

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this lore surrounding that

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but your book is about as dense and

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thorough as a book on this subject could

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be

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and the mystery does run quite deep i

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guess i would ask though what is it

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about

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anomalous big cats that captured your

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attention

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over other diamond manifestations let's

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say

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well greg listen it's an honor to be on

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your show

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patrick has told me that i should be

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very honoured and i am

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so thank you very much but

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the thing about these mystery big cats

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is

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they are commonly seen and britain

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of course as you know is a country that

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doesn't have any big cats

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native to it at all i mean we hardly

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have anything bigger than a

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than a pig really have deer i suppose

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but you know that's a different matter

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so i'm always a bit nervous about

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american listeners because

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they would assume that naturally you

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would have published roaming around in

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the way that perhaps you're doing

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in your part of the states

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but they're a very shocking sight to us

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brits

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i mean you would see them in a zoo or

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sometimes in a private collection or

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something like that

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but one of the most fascinating things

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about um

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the mystery big cats of britain are

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i suppose thousands are seen every year

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but

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they're nearly all i suppose about 85 of

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them

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are black and i mean completely black

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not in the way that a melanistic leopard

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is black

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which is to say very very dark brown but

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you can see the spots shining through

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in sunlight but actually jet lag

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and that's a very rare thing and

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the other sort of 15 i suppose are

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sightings of brown or tan animals

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that resemble humans as we call them

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mountain valleys as you would call them

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maybe or cougars

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the confusing thing is that we call the

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black animals that we see

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black panthers whereas in fact you know

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in real life

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panthers aren't a separate species

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they're just

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a word for a black leopard basically so

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it's confusing from the outset that not

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only do we have big cats but we have

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what look like very rare black leopards

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only

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not even rare black leopards because

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they seem to be blacker than that so

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there

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seem to be a separate thing again

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but some of the most interesting

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sightings

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are of american humours and there's lots

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of different

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suggestions where they could have come

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from

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one of them is that perhaps gi's who

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were stationed in britain during the

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second world war

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left them behind us mascots and they

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bred

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which is a sort of rather interesting

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thought

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but not very practical

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there's a lot of speculation about where

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they could have come from these big cats

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people see them pleasingly they cross

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the road they see them in the woods they

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see them crossing their gardens they

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appear here and there and then sort of

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magically disappear

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or when i say magically people are

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terrified at the sight of them obviously

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and they call the police and the police

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search and

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go up in helicopters and things with

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thermal imaging equipment and

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everything and they never find them so

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it's kind of disturbing the awful thing

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is that

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there's a huge discrepancy between

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the evidence from eyewitnesses which is

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incredibly detailed and usually

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absolutely cast iron

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and the amount of physical evidence on

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the ground

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people still haven't found you know the

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body of a

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black panther they still haven't found

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anything that they could really pin on

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being an actual

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species living out here in britain

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undiscovered

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so it reminds me of your bigfoot

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searches in america and i suppose

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northwest of your country particularly

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you know there's a masses of evidence

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and it's all

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anecdotal and it's absolutely brilliant

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evidence but they're still looking for

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that body i think

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aren't they yes they are and that's a

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pretty

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good introduction to the mystery as you

287
00:10:36,870 --> 00:10:34,640
say

288
00:10:38,389 --> 00:10:36,880
nowhere in great britain are big cats

289
00:10:40,310 --> 00:10:38,399
like this native

290
00:10:42,790 --> 00:10:40,320
and people can do all kinds of mental

291
00:10:45,110 --> 00:10:42,800
gymnastics to try to figure out

292
00:10:47,829 --> 00:10:45,120
how physical big cats would have gotten

293
00:10:50,069 --> 00:10:47,839
there but nothing really holds water

294
00:10:50,870 --> 00:10:50,079
sometimes in these sightings the cats

295
00:10:54,069 --> 00:10:50,880
take the

296
00:10:55,829 --> 00:10:54,079
shape of a mountain lion or a puma but a

297
00:10:59,350 --> 00:10:55,839
lot of the time they are

298
00:11:01,269 --> 00:10:59,360
a velvety jet black so if these are real

299
00:11:04,150 --> 00:11:01,279
animals out there now you have to find

300
00:11:06,069 --> 00:11:04,160
multiple species of big cat so the

301
00:11:07,910 --> 00:11:06,079
mystery grows deeper

302
00:11:09,670 --> 00:11:07,920
then of course you gotta contrast

303
00:11:12,870 --> 00:11:09,680
thousands of sightings

304
00:11:15,430 --> 00:11:12,880
some very odd with there being zero dead

305
00:11:17,430 --> 00:11:15,440
bodies but there are even more good

306
00:11:19,829 --> 00:11:17,440
points that further the case that these

307
00:11:21,990 --> 00:11:19,839
are not wild animals or escapees from a

308
00:11:23,670 --> 00:11:22,000
zoo or some private collection

309
00:11:25,750 --> 00:11:23,680
what would those be give the people a

310
00:11:27,910 --> 00:11:25,760
little more in that regard beyond just

311
00:11:29,430 --> 00:11:27,920
the lack of dead bodies what are some of

312
00:11:31,670 --> 00:11:29,440
the other bullet points that

313
00:11:33,750 --> 00:11:31,680
let us know this is much stranger than

314
00:11:35,829 --> 00:11:33,760
it might seem at first

315
00:11:38,230 --> 00:11:35,839
well greg the thing is there are sort of

316
00:11:41,590 --> 00:11:38,240
the three main mysteries

317
00:11:44,150 --> 00:11:41,600
about these creatures

318
00:11:44,949 --> 00:11:44,160
one is that the big cat experience which

319
00:11:47,509 --> 00:11:44,959
people have

320
00:11:49,670 --> 00:11:47,519
which they see them strolling across

321
00:11:51,910 --> 00:11:49,680
their fields

322
00:11:53,110 --> 00:11:51,920
and the second mystery is as i've just

323
00:11:55,829 --> 00:11:53,120
said

324
00:11:58,069 --> 00:11:55,839
so many of them are jet black a few of

325
00:11:59,910 --> 00:11:58,079
them are brown

326
00:12:01,190 --> 00:11:59,920
and the third mysteries there are no

327
00:12:04,230 --> 00:12:01,200
spots

328
00:12:05,750 --> 00:12:04,240
so the thing is that people

329
00:12:08,470 --> 00:12:05,760
really scrape the barrel when they when

330
00:12:09,030 --> 00:12:08,480
they try and imagine how these creatures

331
00:12:12,790 --> 00:12:09,040
could

332
00:12:15,190 --> 00:12:12,800
have come to pass in our country

333
00:12:16,069 --> 00:12:15,200
indeed and so often we just accept the

334
00:12:18,150 --> 00:12:16,079
easy answer

335
00:12:19,509 --> 00:12:18,160
and we don't look any further into it

336
00:12:21,670 --> 00:12:19,519
although as you said

337
00:12:23,990 --> 00:12:21,680
that was another one of the big ones not

338
00:12:25,750 --> 00:12:24,000
only are they never found dead or even

339
00:12:27,110 --> 00:12:25,760
trapped but there are thousands of

340
00:12:29,269 --> 00:12:27,120
reports of tan ones

341
00:12:31,670 --> 00:12:29,279
thousands of reports of black ones but

342
00:12:33,350 --> 00:12:31,680
no reports of any with spots

343
00:12:34,790 --> 00:12:33,360
i think your notification kind of

344
00:12:36,470 --> 00:12:34,800
drowned you out at that point and i'm

345
00:12:38,470 --> 00:12:36,480
sorry i got you in this precarious

346
00:12:40,550 --> 00:12:38,480
situation with this new software and

347
00:12:43,509 --> 00:12:40,560
you're sharing a single set of earbuds

348
00:12:45,350 --> 00:12:43,519
i know it's not easy but anyway it's

349
00:12:47,829 --> 00:12:45,360
significant because the leopards with

350
00:12:50,069 --> 00:12:47,839
the spots are the same species of cat

351
00:12:51,110 --> 00:12:50,079
as the black ones and spots are far more

352
00:12:53,190 --> 00:12:51,120
common

353
00:12:54,790 --> 00:12:53,200
people also claim to see lynxes and

354
00:12:57,269 --> 00:12:54,800
pumas with links like

355
00:12:58,150 --> 00:12:57,279
ears so they're definitely not

356
00:13:01,590 --> 00:12:58,160
describing

357
00:13:03,430 --> 00:13:01,600
some wild animal or even the same thing

358
00:13:05,030 --> 00:13:03,440
if you know anything about big cats

359
00:13:07,190 --> 00:13:05,040
these three mysteries

360
00:13:08,150 --> 00:13:07,200
as you put it should be enough to make

361
00:13:11,430 --> 00:13:08,160
the case that

362
00:13:12,629 --> 00:13:11,440
conventional explanations don't stack up

363
00:13:14,629 --> 00:13:12,639
and we didn't even talk about the

364
00:13:15,350 --> 00:13:14,639
paranormal aspects of these sightings

365
00:13:17,110 --> 00:13:15,360
yet

366
00:13:18,870 --> 00:13:17,120
but let's fast forward to that a bit so

367
00:13:19,990 --> 00:13:18,880
we've established there is more to the

368
00:13:23,350 --> 00:13:20,000
mystery than anyone

369
00:13:25,110 --> 00:13:23,360
might think at first well patrick let me

370
00:13:26,870 --> 00:13:25,120
bring you in here because the long and

371
00:13:28,389 --> 00:13:26,880
short of it is that these big cat

372
00:13:30,710 --> 00:13:28,399
sightings might be

373
00:13:32,230 --> 00:13:30,720
diamonds and it's been a while since

374
00:13:33,910 --> 00:13:32,240
that last talk we had

375
00:13:35,509 --> 00:13:33,920
remind the people how the greeks

376
00:13:37,509 --> 00:13:35,519
describe diamonds

377
00:13:38,949 --> 00:13:37,519
and what their place and function in

378
00:13:41,110 --> 00:13:38,959
reality is

379
00:13:42,150 --> 00:13:41,120
definitely important context if that is

380
00:13:45,350 --> 00:13:42,160
in fact what we

381
00:13:45,829 --> 00:13:45,360
might be dealing with here yeah sure i

382
00:13:47,829 --> 00:13:45,839
mean

383
00:13:50,389 --> 00:13:47,839
i want to emphasize that merrily went

384
00:13:52,710 --> 00:13:50,399
the naturalistic route at great

385
00:13:53,829 --> 00:13:52,720
length and in great depth first before

386
00:13:57,110 --> 00:13:53,839
she

387
00:13:59,670 --> 00:13:57,120
had to turn in desperation to my

388
00:14:00,870 --> 00:13:59,680
theory of diamonds you know it's not

389
00:14:03,990 --> 00:14:00,880
like that was her first

390
00:14:06,790 --> 00:14:04,000
port of call yeah

391
00:14:07,829 --> 00:14:06,800
i basically borrowed from the ancient

392
00:14:11,189 --> 00:14:07,839
greeks the term

393
00:14:14,710 --> 00:14:11,199
diamonds as a general word

394
00:14:17,990 --> 00:14:14,720
to stand for both supernatural creatures

395
00:14:19,829 --> 00:14:18,000
which all cultures at all times have

396
00:14:22,550 --> 00:14:19,839
recognized

397
00:14:23,829 --> 00:14:22,560
it's not like they're exceptional i mean

398
00:14:25,990 --> 00:14:23,839
there are the fairies

399
00:14:28,389 --> 00:14:26,000
in ireland there are the elves in europe

400
00:14:32,069 --> 00:14:28,399
there are the jinn in arabia

401
00:14:33,189 --> 00:14:32,079
every first nation tribe in the united

402
00:14:36,310 --> 00:14:33,199
states

403
00:14:40,550 --> 00:14:36,320
would attest to demonic

404
00:14:42,790 --> 00:14:40,560
beings you know who they interact with

405
00:14:45,030 --> 00:14:42,800
and so it's all the more remarkable that

406
00:14:48,150 --> 00:14:45,040
the western world has now completely

407
00:14:49,590 --> 00:14:48,160
ignored these creatures but one of the

408
00:14:53,509 --> 00:14:49,600
reasons they're ignored is

409
00:14:56,629 --> 00:14:53,519
they just oh you know they have at least

410
00:14:58,949 --> 00:14:56,639
five characteristics which just don't

411
00:15:01,990 --> 00:14:58,959
fit our model of the world

412
00:15:04,629 --> 00:15:02,000
for example they're always ambiguous and

413
00:15:05,269 --> 00:15:04,639
contradictory for example they can be

414
00:15:08,629 --> 00:15:05,279
both

415
00:15:09,590 --> 00:15:08,639
benevolent and malignant like the

416
00:15:12,790 --> 00:15:09,600
fairies

417
00:15:14,470 --> 00:15:12,800
diamonds are always tricky always

418
00:15:17,430 --> 00:15:14,480
mischievous

419
00:15:18,230 --> 00:15:17,440
so they can be anything from extremely

420
00:15:21,430 --> 00:15:18,240
helpful

421
00:15:23,030 --> 00:15:21,440
to life-threatening but their main

422
00:15:25,110 --> 00:15:23,040
contradiction of course and the one that

423
00:15:28,629 --> 00:15:25,120
is the great stumbling block to all

424
00:15:31,590 --> 00:15:28,639
investigators of paranormal anomalous

425
00:15:33,430 --> 00:15:31,600
animals is they can be both material and

426
00:15:35,189 --> 00:15:33,440
immaterial

427
00:15:36,949 --> 00:15:35,199
and that's something it's very difficult

428
00:15:39,670 --> 00:15:36,959
to get your head around

429
00:15:40,150 --> 00:15:39,680
it's not like they are either physical

430
00:15:43,110 --> 00:15:40,160
or

431
00:15:44,629 --> 00:15:43,120
kind of spirit things they seem to be

432
00:15:47,430 --> 00:15:44,639
able to manifest

433
00:15:48,470 --> 00:15:47,440
as one or the other or both at once

434
00:15:52,710 --> 00:15:48,480
secondly they're

435
00:15:54,870 --> 00:15:52,720
always elusive usually fast moving and

436
00:15:55,829 --> 00:15:54,880
usually disappearing in the twinkling of

437
00:15:59,430 --> 00:15:55,839
an eye

438
00:16:01,670 --> 00:15:59,440
that's a characteristic of all diamonds

439
00:16:04,150 --> 00:16:01,680
very important thirdly is that they

440
00:16:06,949 --> 00:16:04,160
shape-shift

441
00:16:08,389 --> 00:16:06,959
not just in space but across time

442
00:16:11,430 --> 00:16:08,399
interestingly so that

443
00:16:14,150 --> 00:16:11,440
whenever we try and banish them from

444
00:16:15,670 --> 00:16:14,160
one field of study they pop up in

445
00:16:18,150 --> 00:16:15,680
another for example in

446
00:16:20,629 --> 00:16:18,160
diamondic reality i try and make the

447
00:16:24,389 --> 00:16:20,639
case that when the diamonds

448
00:16:26,790 --> 00:16:24,399
that appear naturally in nature were

449
00:16:28,310 --> 00:16:26,800
discredited banished pooh-poohed

450
00:16:33,030 --> 00:16:28,320
altogether

451
00:16:34,470 --> 00:16:33,040
and in this case in the victorian

452
00:16:37,749 --> 00:16:34,480
drawing rooms

453
00:16:38,710 --> 00:16:37,759
as spirits of the seance who manifested

454
00:16:44,230 --> 00:16:38,720
the same

455
00:16:49,110 --> 00:16:47,189
substance as the diamonds in nature did

456
00:16:50,710 --> 00:16:49,120
and i would even argue that

457
00:16:52,310 --> 00:16:50,720
when they were banished from when

458
00:16:54,870 --> 00:16:52,320
spiritualism

459
00:16:56,069 --> 00:16:54,880
went out of fashion they may well

460
00:16:59,350 --> 00:16:56,079
reappear as

461
00:17:02,629 --> 00:16:59,360
subatomic particles if you describe

462
00:17:04,309 --> 00:17:02,639
an electron for instance it has all the

463
00:17:06,309 --> 00:17:04,319
diamond characteristics it's

464
00:17:08,309 --> 00:17:06,319
contradictory it's both the wave and the

465
00:17:10,549 --> 00:17:08,319
particle it's very elusive it's fast

466
00:17:13,590 --> 00:17:10,559
moving and so and so on

467
00:17:15,270 --> 00:17:13,600
so these creatures are i mean what else

468
00:17:16,789 --> 00:17:15,280
are they they're marginal they always

469
00:17:19,110 --> 00:17:16,799
appear in

470
00:17:21,429 --> 00:17:19,120
what's popularly called liminal zones

471
00:17:24,949 --> 00:17:21,439
you know threshold places bridges

472
00:17:27,990 --> 00:17:24,959
crossroads seashores things like that

473
00:17:31,750 --> 00:17:28,000
and also at sort of threshold times

474
00:17:32,950 --> 00:17:31,760
midnight mid-summer eve that's the great

475
00:17:35,909 --> 00:17:32,960
time of the fairies

476
00:17:36,789 --> 00:17:35,919
halloween that's an old pagan festival

477
00:17:39,669 --> 00:17:36,799
which was a

478
00:17:41,669 --> 00:17:39,679
kind of a hinge of the year and so on

479
00:17:44,710 --> 00:17:41,679
they also appear of course

480
00:17:46,310 --> 00:17:44,720
between sleeping and waking for instance

481
00:17:47,830 --> 00:17:46,320
that's a liminal zone a more

482
00:17:49,990 --> 00:17:47,840
psychological one

483
00:17:52,870 --> 00:17:50,000
they appear as it were between the

484
00:17:56,070 --> 00:17:52,880
consciousness and the unconscious

485
00:17:57,669 --> 00:17:56,080
so all attempts to categorize them or

486
00:18:00,870 --> 00:17:57,679
bring them into

487
00:18:02,310 --> 00:18:00,880
mainstream orthodoxy whether it's in the

488
00:18:04,630 --> 00:18:02,320
olden days the church

489
00:18:06,230 --> 00:18:04,640
who banished them didn't believe in them

490
00:18:09,430 --> 00:18:06,240
or nowadays science

491
00:18:12,070 --> 00:18:09,440
which just ignores them or

492
00:18:13,029 --> 00:18:12,080
suppresses them they'll never actually

493
00:18:17,990 --> 00:18:13,039
become

494
00:18:21,990 --> 00:18:18,000
mainstream as bigfoot researchers or

495
00:18:23,990 --> 00:18:22,000
ufologists no to their cast so on

496
00:18:27,669 --> 00:18:24,000
and it may be finally that the role of

497
00:18:31,750 --> 00:18:27,679
the diamonds is as socrates said

498
00:18:33,750 --> 00:18:31,760
intermediary between us and the gods

499
00:18:35,110 --> 00:18:33,760
this ties up with their contradictory

500
00:18:37,190 --> 00:18:35,120
nature

501
00:18:39,190 --> 00:18:37,200
they mediate between the material and

502
00:18:42,390 --> 00:18:39,200
the material between the personal

503
00:18:45,350 --> 00:18:42,400
and the impersonal between this world

504
00:18:47,110 --> 00:18:45,360
and the other world they even mediate

505
00:18:50,390 --> 00:18:47,120
between

506
00:18:55,270 --> 00:18:50,400
fact and fiction it's difficult to know

507
00:18:58,549 --> 00:18:55,280
in folklore whether personal encounters

508
00:18:59,909 --> 00:18:58,559
with folkloric creatures supernatural

509
00:19:02,710 --> 00:18:59,919
creatures

510
00:19:04,789 --> 00:19:02,720
come before the stories that are

511
00:19:06,070 --> 00:19:04,799
subsequently told about them or vice

512
00:19:07,909 --> 00:19:06,080
versa

513
00:19:09,110 --> 00:19:07,919
it's very difficult to disentangle fact

514
00:19:10,549 --> 00:19:09,120
and fiction

515
00:19:12,390 --> 00:19:10,559
in fact it may not be useful to

516
00:19:16,230 --> 00:19:12,400
disentangle them

517
00:19:19,830 --> 00:19:16,240
so experts in

518
00:19:22,310 --> 00:19:19,840
diamonds they've always been experts as

519
00:19:23,590 --> 00:19:22,320
socrates says you know that there are

520
00:19:25,909 --> 00:19:23,600
certain demonic

521
00:19:28,470 --> 00:19:25,919
men and demonic women who have

522
00:19:32,789 --> 00:19:28,480
conversation with this other world

523
00:19:35,990 --> 00:19:32,799
and they used to be wise women shamans

524
00:19:39,350 --> 00:19:36,000
mediums witch doctors whatever

525
00:19:42,549 --> 00:19:39,360
nowadays they tend to be i don't know

526
00:19:43,430 --> 00:19:42,559
poets visionaries you know it still goes

527
00:19:46,549 --> 00:19:43,440
on

528
00:19:48,789 --> 00:19:46,559
or

529
00:19:51,430 --> 00:19:48,799
description of what demons are like and

530
00:19:54,470 --> 00:19:51,440
what their characteristics are

531
00:19:57,270 --> 00:19:54,480
um i love it the

532
00:19:58,470 --> 00:19:57,280
demonic model does make the most sense

533
00:20:00,789 --> 00:19:58,480
to me

534
00:20:02,950 --> 00:20:00,799
but it does take a lot to get our

535
00:20:04,630 --> 00:20:02,960
attention these days we're so distracted

536
00:20:07,190 --> 00:20:04,640
and on a different page that

537
00:20:09,750 --> 00:20:07,200
mothman grey aliens and thunderbirds can

538
00:20:12,390 --> 00:20:09,760
barely get us to look up from our phones

539
00:20:14,310 --> 00:20:12,400
if these diamonds can walk between the

540
00:20:17,750 --> 00:20:14,320
worlds and take different forms

541
00:20:18,390 --> 00:20:17,760
why this form at this time is there any

542
00:20:21,190 --> 00:20:18,400
logic

543
00:20:22,630 --> 00:20:21,200
or reasoning you guys can put to why

544
00:20:27,029 --> 00:20:22,640
they would choose to appear

545
00:20:30,789 --> 00:20:27,039
as big cats in the last few decades

546
00:20:34,070 --> 00:20:30,799
oh god well that's the big question greg

547
00:20:37,430 --> 00:20:34,080
i don't i don't think i can answer that

548
00:20:40,870 --> 00:20:37,440
but when patrick was talking about

549
00:20:42,630 --> 00:20:40,880
you know sort of demonic experiences and

550
00:20:45,190 --> 00:20:42,640
the impossibility of getting our heads

551
00:20:47,830 --> 00:20:45,200
around that demonic world

552
00:20:48,390 --> 00:20:47,840
i was just going to give you an example

553
00:20:50,950 --> 00:20:48,400
actually

554
00:20:52,870 --> 00:20:50,960
of a woman who just contacted me a

555
00:20:55,830 --> 00:20:52,880
couple of days ago

556
00:20:57,510 --> 00:20:55,840
with the description of the big cat she

557
00:21:03,510 --> 00:20:57,520
had encountered

558
00:21:07,430 --> 00:21:03,520
and it was so interestingly tangible

559
00:21:09,510 --> 00:21:07,440
and real and at the same time so strange

560
00:21:11,190 --> 00:21:09,520
that i thought it might interest you

561
00:21:13,350 --> 00:21:11,200
sure

562
00:21:15,830 --> 00:21:13,360
the woman is called joyce thomas and she

563
00:21:19,590 --> 00:21:15,840
lives in wales

564
00:21:22,789 --> 00:21:19,600
she said it was in september 2009

565
00:21:24,230 --> 00:21:22,799
and it was past midnight and she did

566
00:21:26,070 --> 00:21:24,240
good night to her husband who was

567
00:21:27,510 --> 00:21:26,080
watching television downstairs and she'd

568
00:21:29,430 --> 00:21:27,520
gone up to bed

569
00:21:31,590 --> 00:21:29,440
and it was a warm night and she opened

570
00:21:33,510 --> 00:21:31,600
her window to enjoy

571
00:21:34,789 --> 00:21:33,520
a few quiet moments breathing in the

572
00:21:37,830 --> 00:21:34,799
evening air

573
00:21:40,470 --> 00:21:37,840
and this is what she said she said as i

574
00:21:43,510 --> 00:21:40,480
leaned out i saw a flash of movement

575
00:21:45,590 --> 00:21:43,520
directly below me as a shadow darted out

576
00:21:49,110 --> 00:21:45,600
around the corner of the porch

577
00:21:50,950 --> 00:21:49,120
and off into the yard area this movement

578
00:21:54,149 --> 00:21:50,960
was so fast and silent

579
00:21:57,430 --> 00:21:54,159
that i thought i must have been mistaken

580
00:21:59,510 --> 00:21:57,440
however within a minute or two i became

581
00:22:02,630 --> 00:21:59,520
aware that the darting shadow

582
00:22:03,909 --> 00:22:02,640
had reappeared in the yard and to my

583
00:22:05,830 --> 00:22:03,919
astonishment

584
00:22:07,510 --> 00:22:05,840
as i stood there staring out at the

585
00:22:09,590 --> 00:22:07,520
garden a cat

586
00:22:11,590 --> 00:22:09,600
dashed directly in the dead straight

587
00:22:13,750 --> 00:22:11,600
line across our yard

588
00:22:16,070 --> 00:22:13,760
right in front of my eyes and

589
00:22:18,230 --> 00:22:16,080
disappeared under the rose arch

590
00:22:20,149 --> 00:22:18,240
and out into the blacklist of the garden

591
00:22:22,149 --> 00:22:20,159
itself

592
00:22:23,590 --> 00:22:22,159
the speed with which this occurred was

593
00:22:25,350 --> 00:22:23,600
breathtaking

594
00:22:27,750 --> 00:22:25,360
and it seemed that this animal was

595
00:22:30,630 --> 00:22:27,760
pursuing a dead straight line

596
00:22:33,029 --> 00:22:30,640
across my yard on a mission that i knew

597
00:22:35,669 --> 00:22:33,039
nothing of

598
00:22:37,750 --> 00:22:35,679
she said it moved with a purpose and at

599
00:22:38,950 --> 00:22:37,760
a speed that had little to do with this

600
00:22:41,990 --> 00:22:38,960
reality

601
00:22:43,430 --> 00:22:42,000
i think it definitely was a cat but a

602
00:22:45,909 --> 00:22:43,440
strange one

603
00:22:48,470 --> 00:22:45,919
it was black all over even blacker than

604
00:22:51,590 --> 00:22:48,480
the backdrop of a dark garden

605
00:22:54,149 --> 00:22:51,600
its two ears were pointed and erect but

606
00:22:56,470 --> 00:22:54,159
it was the tail that drew my attention

607
00:22:58,630 --> 00:22:56,480
held out behind its body absolutely

608
00:23:01,430 --> 00:22:58,640
ramrod straight

609
00:23:02,470 --> 00:23:01,440
even more curiously it seemed to be

610
00:23:05,510 --> 00:23:02,480
running slightly

611
00:23:08,470 --> 00:23:05,520
levitated as if it did not seem to have

612
00:23:10,310 --> 00:23:08,480
its feet on the ground i had the

613
00:23:11,430 --> 00:23:10,320
impression that it looked like a cartoon

614
00:23:14,070 --> 00:23:11,440
film

615
00:23:15,510 --> 00:23:14,080
a curious two-dimensional quality graced

616
00:23:18,870 --> 00:23:15,520
the whole episode

617
00:23:21,909 --> 00:23:18,880
as if i was watching a silent movie

618
00:23:23,350 --> 00:23:21,919
there was no noise of any kind absolute

619
00:23:26,230 --> 00:23:23,360
silence prevailed throughout the

620
00:23:28,710 --> 00:23:26,240
experience and going down to the rose

621
00:23:30,549 --> 00:23:28,720
arch with a measuring tape next morning

622
00:23:32,390 --> 00:23:30,559
i reckoned it must have been about two

623
00:23:35,350 --> 00:23:32,400
foot six inches tall

624
00:23:36,710 --> 00:23:35,360
and five foot long more the size of a

625
00:23:40,630 --> 00:23:36,720
panther than a domestic

626
00:23:42,549 --> 00:23:40,640
cat most puzzling of all to me

627
00:23:44,710 --> 00:23:42,559
and you know i interject here this is

628
00:23:46,470 --> 00:23:44,720
indeed very interesting and

629
00:23:48,149 --> 00:23:46,480
i'm not sure if the bigfoot literature

630
00:23:51,110 --> 00:23:48,159
has anything of this

631
00:23:53,029 --> 00:23:51,120
kind she said most puzzling of all to me

632
00:23:54,789 --> 00:23:53,039
was the light which surrounded this

633
00:23:57,990 --> 00:23:54,799
black cat

634
00:24:00,870 --> 00:23:58,000
i cannot account for it it didn't glow

635
00:24:02,470 --> 00:24:00,880
it was not translucent the cat itself

636
00:24:04,630 --> 00:24:02,480
was not luminous

637
00:24:07,269 --> 00:24:04,640
and beyond a few inches surrounding the

638
00:24:09,190 --> 00:24:07,279
apparition i could see nothing

639
00:24:11,430 --> 00:24:09,200
but there seemed to be a pinky blue

640
00:24:13,909 --> 00:24:11,440
light around the phenomenon

641
00:24:15,269 --> 00:24:13,919
it was very faint and there seemed to be

642
00:24:19,590 --> 00:24:15,279
a vague swirl

643
00:24:21,830 --> 00:24:19,600
as the cat moved through on its quest

644
00:24:22,870 --> 00:24:21,840
and in light of what pat was saying

645
00:24:25,830 --> 00:24:22,880
about

646
00:24:27,510 --> 00:24:25,840
activities of demons and their straight

647
00:24:30,630 --> 00:24:27,520
lines and so forth

648
00:24:33,269 --> 00:24:30,640
she adds incidentally the path the cat

649
00:24:35,510 --> 00:24:33,279
was taking with such determination

650
00:24:36,870 --> 00:24:35,520
was at a direct right angle with the

651
00:24:39,750 --> 00:24:36,880
other straight line

652
00:24:42,149 --> 00:24:39,760
made by the footpath along the house i

653
00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:42,159
was reminded of old folklore

654
00:24:45,590 --> 00:24:44,320
about not building houses on fairy

655
00:24:48,310 --> 00:24:45,600
pathways

656
00:24:48,710 --> 00:24:48,320
and if one did to always let the fairy

657
00:24:51,350 --> 00:24:48,720
folk

658
00:24:52,470 --> 00:24:51,360
pass unhindered through open doorways

659
00:24:55,830 --> 00:24:52,480
and the likes

660
00:24:57,269 --> 00:24:55,840
in this case my rose arch

661
00:25:00,630 --> 00:24:57,279
so i thought that was a really

662
00:25:02,070 --> 00:25:00,640
interesting letter because it sort of

663
00:25:04,070 --> 00:25:02,080
combines

664
00:25:06,789 --> 00:25:04,080
the experience of seeing what was

665
00:25:09,110 --> 00:25:06,799
apparently a pamper-like animal

666
00:25:10,870 --> 00:25:09,120
and a lot of the characteristics that

667
00:25:12,470 --> 00:25:10,880
the old-fashioned traditional demons

668
00:25:15,029 --> 00:25:12,480
have

669
00:25:17,190 --> 00:25:15,039
yes i like that account a lot especially

670
00:25:18,549 --> 00:25:17,200
that little detail about the glow

671
00:25:20,310 --> 00:25:18,559
i don't think i've ever heard a story

672
00:25:22,789 --> 00:25:20,320
like that in bigfoot lore

673
00:25:24,390 --> 00:25:22,799
but it might be in there somewhere and

674
00:25:26,710 --> 00:25:24,400
you do have some stories

675
00:25:28,870 --> 00:25:26,720
in the book where the big cats have

676
00:25:31,510 --> 00:25:28,880
glowing eyes you have stories where they

677
00:25:33,909 --> 00:25:31,520
just seem to fade out and dissipate

678
00:25:36,310 --> 00:25:33,919
oftentimes they walk into some tall

679
00:25:38,149 --> 00:25:36,320
brush and like that they're gone i read

680
00:25:40,310 --> 00:25:38,159
that several times

681
00:25:41,590 --> 00:25:40,320
but it's an interesting detail about the

682
00:25:43,430 --> 00:25:41,600
walking path too

683
00:25:44,630 --> 00:25:43,440
and i think that's where your book

684
00:25:47,510 --> 00:25:44,640
really takes off

685
00:25:48,470 --> 00:25:47,520
is when you get into the topography of

686
00:25:50,710 --> 00:25:48,480
the landscape

687
00:25:52,789 --> 00:25:50,720
where these encounters happen because

688
00:25:53,430 --> 00:25:52,799
there do seem to be some commonalities

689
00:25:55,510 --> 00:25:53,440
to the

690
00:25:57,029 --> 00:25:55,520
siding locations that might very well

691
00:26:00,149 --> 00:25:57,039
relate to the way

692
00:26:01,750 --> 00:26:00,159
energy flows through a landscape

693
00:26:03,909 --> 00:26:01,760
that seems like a big deal can you talk

694
00:26:06,710 --> 00:26:03,919
to us about that a bit

695
00:26:08,630 --> 00:26:06,720
yes indeed greg one of the things when i

696
00:26:11,990 --> 00:26:08,640
started to research this one of the

697
00:26:16,149 --> 00:26:12,000
striking things was that these big cuts

698
00:26:17,350 --> 00:26:16,159
do seem to favor certain topographical

699
00:26:20,149 --> 00:26:17,360
features

700
00:26:21,990 --> 00:26:20,159
principally for instance railways

701
00:26:25,510 --> 00:26:22,000
they're constantly seen

702
00:26:27,350 --> 00:26:25,520
on and around railways and in fact

703
00:26:28,950 --> 00:26:27,360
one railway worker who was checking the

704
00:26:32,230 --> 00:26:28,960
line at night

705
00:26:34,789 --> 00:26:32,240
was followed several miles by a big cat

706
00:26:37,110 --> 00:26:34,799
a black panther type creature as he

707
00:26:38,710 --> 00:26:37,120
walked up the line

708
00:26:41,190 --> 00:26:38,720
the other places they seem to find

709
00:26:44,870 --> 00:26:41,200
themselves are quarries

710
00:26:49,350 --> 00:26:44,880
and holes in the ground

711
00:26:53,110 --> 00:26:49,360
and steep edges of things

712
00:26:55,909 --> 00:26:53,120
precipices i suppose railways gates

713
00:26:58,470 --> 00:26:55,919
tunnels anything that is like a hoe in

714
00:27:00,710 --> 00:26:58,480
the ground

715
00:27:01,990 --> 00:27:00,720
generally it seems to attract those

716
00:27:03,350 --> 00:27:02,000
sorts of creatures

717
00:27:06,630 --> 00:27:03,360
or at least that's where they seem to

718
00:27:09,190 --> 00:27:06,640
manifest let's put it that way

719
00:27:10,710 --> 00:27:09,200
one of the interesting things about big

720
00:27:12,630 --> 00:27:10,720
cats is that

721
00:27:15,830 --> 00:27:12,640
well they've often been compared to the

722
00:27:19,029 --> 00:27:15,840
folkloric black dogs which occur in

723
00:27:22,149 --> 00:27:19,039
in the folklore of great britain as well

724
00:27:25,350 --> 00:27:22,159
and black dogs are generally found near

725
00:27:28,549 --> 00:27:25,360
watercourses and streams and rivers

726
00:27:32,549 --> 00:27:28,559
whereas big mystery big cats

727
00:27:35,669 --> 00:27:32,559
appear along railways and rather unusual

728
00:27:36,230 --> 00:27:35,679
topographical features should i give you

729
00:27:38,950 --> 00:27:36,240
a little

730
00:27:42,230 --> 00:27:38,960
golf courses too yeah they love a golf

731
00:27:44,470 --> 00:27:42,240
course for some bizarre reason they do

732
00:27:46,630 --> 00:27:44,480
i think it's because golf courses are a

733
00:27:50,549 --> 00:27:46,640
very manufactured man-made

734
00:27:52,310 --> 00:27:50,559
arrangement of roughs and smooths and

735
00:27:54,230 --> 00:27:52,320
if we're to go down the taoist route

736
00:27:57,990 --> 00:27:54,240
which i won't but maybe pat will i

737
00:28:00,310 --> 00:27:58,000
won't well we could also say golf

738
00:28:01,510 --> 00:28:00,320
courses in some cases especially here in

739
00:28:04,230 --> 00:28:01,520
the states

740
00:28:05,190 --> 00:28:04,240
are obviously developed but they're the

741
00:28:07,990 --> 00:28:05,200
closest thing

742
00:28:09,909 --> 00:28:08,000
to uninterrupted nature that we leave in

743
00:28:12,070 --> 00:28:09,919
place sometimes well that's it

744
00:28:13,510 --> 00:28:12,080
they are sort of liminal places in

745
00:28:17,669 --> 00:28:13,520
themselves because they're half

746
00:28:20,070 --> 00:28:17,679
nature but half civilized you know

747
00:28:20,789 --> 00:28:20,080
yeah and the words rough and smooth

748
00:28:23,269 --> 00:28:20,799
capture

749
00:28:24,789 --> 00:28:23,279
that kind of ambiguity that surrounds

750
00:28:27,990 --> 00:28:24,799
golf courses

751
00:28:28,710 --> 00:28:28,000
you know greens and fairways versus the

752
00:28:31,430 --> 00:28:28,720
rough

753
00:28:32,789 --> 00:28:31,440
that sort of thing there's a rather

754
00:28:35,350 --> 00:28:32,799
interesting

755
00:28:36,789 --> 00:28:35,360
account from a man who's out at night

756
00:28:40,710 --> 00:28:36,799
poaching

757
00:28:43,029 --> 00:28:40,720
with his friend he was shining his

758
00:28:44,630 --> 00:28:43,039
his huge lamp around and he saw a big

759
00:28:46,950 --> 00:28:44,640
cat

760
00:28:48,230 --> 00:28:46,960
disappearing up a railway embankment

761
00:28:50,630 --> 00:28:48,240
onto the line

762
00:28:51,990 --> 00:28:50,640
and he wrote he said the following day

763
00:28:53,909 --> 00:28:52,000
in broad daylight

764
00:28:55,110 --> 00:28:53,919
i walked along the track opposite the

765
00:28:56,710 --> 00:28:55,120
gateway

766
00:28:58,950 --> 00:28:56,720
which is where we'd seen the animal

767
00:29:01,430 --> 00:28:58,960
emerge in the first place

768
00:29:04,230 --> 00:29:01,440
and he said this track runs across

769
00:29:06,710 --> 00:29:04,240
fields parallel to the railway lines

770
00:29:07,990 --> 00:29:06,720
about a quarter of a mile from the road

771
00:29:10,710 --> 00:29:08,000
a large conduit

772
00:29:12,710 --> 00:29:10,720
pipe runs under the railway track and

773
00:29:13,430 --> 00:29:12,720
carries overflow water in the bad

774
00:29:15,669 --> 00:29:13,440
weather

775
00:29:16,870 --> 00:29:15,679
down into the stream that runs alongside

776
00:29:19,430 --> 00:29:16,880
the railway line

777
00:29:20,870 --> 00:29:19,440
on the field side the height of the pipe

778
00:29:24,230 --> 00:29:20,880
is about four or five

779
00:29:26,389 --> 00:29:24,240
feet and the length of it i have no idea

780
00:29:29,750 --> 00:29:26,399
because my dog wouldn't enter it but

781
00:29:32,870 --> 00:29:29,760
whined and tried to pull off his lead

782
00:29:35,830 --> 00:29:32,880
so there was a huge collection there of

783
00:29:36,789 --> 00:29:35,840
interesting topographical features

784
00:29:40,870 --> 00:29:36,799
tunnels

785
00:29:43,350 --> 00:29:40,880
rails holes streams path

786
00:29:44,230 --> 00:29:43,360
which if you were going to configure a

787
00:29:47,430 --> 00:29:44,240
place where a

788
00:29:48,149 --> 00:29:47,440
big black cat might appear those are the

789
00:29:50,710 --> 00:29:48,159
features

790
00:29:51,909 --> 00:29:50,720
that you would expect one too

791
00:29:53,269 --> 00:29:51,919
[Music]

792
00:29:55,750 --> 00:29:53,279
and it did actually appear and it

793
00:29:57,909 --> 00:29:55,760
terrified his dog and it terrified him

794
00:30:01,190 --> 00:29:57,919
too

795
00:30:02,310 --> 00:30:01,200
well that makes sense and to dig deeper

796
00:30:04,310 --> 00:30:02,320
into why those

797
00:30:06,549 --> 00:30:04,320
are features one might expect to have a

798
00:30:06,870 --> 00:30:06,559
sighting around and the comparisons with

799
00:30:10,710 --> 00:30:06,880
the

800
00:30:13,190 --> 00:30:10,720
spectral hellhound black dog phenomena

801
00:30:13,909 --> 00:30:13,200
i saw a presentation that you gave at an

802
00:30:17,669 --> 00:30:13,919
event

803
00:30:20,630 --> 00:30:17,679
called megalithomania really great name

804
00:30:21,750 --> 00:30:20,640
great brand and you went deeper into

805
00:30:23,990 --> 00:30:21,760
comparing these two

806
00:30:25,029 --> 00:30:24,000
types of demonic manifestations along

807
00:30:28,070 --> 00:30:25,039
the lines of yin

808
00:30:29,990 --> 00:30:28,080
and yang or masculine feminine and that

809
00:30:30,389 --> 00:30:30,000
some of these areas that these cats are

810
00:30:32,470 --> 00:30:30,399
found

811
00:30:33,990 --> 00:30:32,480
could be considered landscapes of

812
00:30:36,310 --> 00:30:34,000
feminine energy like you say

813
00:30:38,149 --> 00:30:36,320
tunnels even craters seem to be

814
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:38,159
described quite often

815
00:30:40,389 --> 00:30:39,200
and i thought that was pretty

816
00:30:42,310 --> 00:30:40,399
interesting because if we're talking

817
00:30:45,510 --> 00:30:42,320
about a relationship with these

818
00:30:46,470 --> 00:30:45,520
beans and earth energy or ley lines or

819
00:30:49,510 --> 00:30:46,480
window areas

820
00:30:51,909 --> 00:30:49,520
some kind of electromagnetic connection

821
00:30:53,029 --> 00:30:51,919
maybe it relates to the form you say

822
00:30:55,590 --> 00:30:53,039
that with the dogs

823
00:30:56,149 --> 00:30:55,600
they're reported to be along train

824
00:30:58,470 --> 00:30:56,159
tracks

825
00:31:00,549 --> 00:30:58,480
way more often than they aren't which is

826
00:31:02,630 --> 00:31:00,559
of course a very straight conductive

827
00:31:04,789 --> 00:31:02,640
feature around the landscape

828
00:31:05,669 --> 00:31:04,799
and there are other examples but these

829
00:31:08,149 --> 00:31:05,679
clusters

830
00:31:09,350 --> 00:31:08,159
and overlaps and trends i think they get

831
00:31:11,750 --> 00:31:09,360
us a lot deeper

832
00:31:12,630 --> 00:31:11,760
into understanding how this all works

833
00:31:15,350 --> 00:31:12,640
you know

834
00:31:16,549 --> 00:31:15,360
yeah absolutely greg i mean the subject

835
00:31:18,549 --> 00:31:16,559
gets

836
00:31:20,950 --> 00:31:18,559
deeper and deeper and more and more

837
00:31:23,350 --> 00:31:20,960
difficult the more you get into it

838
00:31:24,070 --> 00:31:23,360
it really does it's a bit of a nightmare

839
00:31:27,750 --> 00:31:24,080
really

840
00:31:31,350 --> 00:31:27,760
but i was very interested by the sort of

841
00:31:34,310 --> 00:31:31,360
that taoist approach

842
00:31:35,269 --> 00:31:34,320
where aspects of the landscape can be

843
00:31:38,630 --> 00:31:35,279
described

844
00:31:43,110 --> 00:31:38,640
as yin feminine

845
00:31:46,630 --> 00:31:43,120
sort of sunken low places marshy places

846
00:31:48,549 --> 00:31:46,640
winding roads and so forth or yang

847
00:31:50,310 --> 00:31:48,559
masculine i mean these are very broad

848
00:31:52,310 --> 00:31:50,320
definitions and i'm sure

849
00:31:53,509 --> 00:31:52,320
i'm doing a great disservice to tourism

850
00:31:56,549 --> 00:31:53,519
when i describe it

851
00:32:00,230 --> 00:31:56,559
in this way but yang would be more

852
00:32:03,190 --> 00:32:00,240
elevated spots pointed areas

853
00:32:03,750 --> 00:32:03,200
and you know the chinese art of feng

854
00:32:07,430 --> 00:32:03,760
shui

855
00:32:11,509 --> 00:32:07,440
and organization of the landscape

856
00:32:13,350 --> 00:32:11,519
was mainly aimed at finding a harmonious

857
00:32:17,110 --> 00:32:13,360
balance between those two

858
00:32:20,870 --> 00:32:17,120
types of landscape feature and thus

859
00:32:24,070 --> 00:32:20,880
harmonious balance between the energies

860
00:32:25,350 --> 00:32:24,080
inherent in the landscape i mean

861
00:32:27,269 --> 00:32:25,360
we would call them masculine and

862
00:32:30,149 --> 00:32:27,279
feminine but those would be very

863
00:32:30,470 --> 00:32:30,159
broad ideas i mean they would really you

864
00:32:32,549 --> 00:32:30,480
know

865
00:32:34,950 --> 00:32:32,559
you couldn't really apply that to

866
00:32:38,070 --> 00:32:34,960
anything more specific

867
00:32:41,909 --> 00:32:38,080
the earth tiger is what the chinese

868
00:32:44,870 --> 00:32:41,919
called it and again i'm not really

869
00:32:45,750 --> 00:32:44,880
an expert on it on that sort of

870
00:32:48,870 --> 00:32:45,760
philosophy

871
00:32:49,509 --> 00:32:48,880
but the very fact that these big cats

872
00:32:52,950 --> 00:32:49,519
appear

873
00:32:55,669 --> 00:32:52,960
in areas that perhaps

874
00:32:57,430 --> 00:32:55,679
well i thought perhaps that the long

875
00:33:00,630 --> 00:32:57,440
straight railway tracks

876
00:33:02,230 --> 00:33:00,640
which would be a sort of a yang feature

877
00:33:05,509 --> 00:33:02,240
of the landscape

878
00:33:08,950 --> 00:33:05,519
masculine straight organized

879
00:33:11,990 --> 00:33:08,960
might precipitate perhaps

880
00:33:15,509 --> 00:33:12,000
a complementary energy in the form

881
00:33:17,430 --> 00:33:15,519
of a mystery big cat which would be more

882
00:33:19,350 --> 00:33:17,440
you could describe perhaps as more of a

883
00:33:23,029 --> 00:33:19,360
yin sort of

884
00:33:24,789 --> 00:33:23,039
manifestation but there again it holds

885
00:33:29,830 --> 00:33:24,799
on the ground you know

886
00:33:34,710 --> 00:33:29,840
tunnels pipes duponts

887
00:33:38,149 --> 00:33:34,720
bomb craters queries quarries thank you

888
00:33:38,710 --> 00:33:38,159
we're perhaps perhaps the yin energies

889
00:33:41,590 --> 00:33:38,720
you know

890
00:33:42,710 --> 00:33:41,600
would sort of gather in those sorts of

891
00:33:44,870 --> 00:33:42,720
places

892
00:33:46,710 --> 00:33:44,880
and again perhaps they would precipitate

893
00:33:49,669 --> 00:33:46,720
the appearance of a

894
00:33:52,149 --> 00:33:49,679
big black cat as a representation of

895
00:33:53,909 --> 00:33:52,159
that particular kind of energy i mean

896
00:33:55,590 --> 00:33:53,919
these are wild speculations it was

897
00:33:59,350 --> 00:33:55,600
helped by the fact that this

898
00:34:00,870 --> 00:33:59,360
rather wonderful woman or rather

899
00:34:03,110 --> 00:34:00,880
well she wasn't a wonderful woman

900
00:34:05,430 --> 00:34:03,120
actually she was she was the person that

901
00:34:08,470 --> 00:34:05,440
wrote the book but the person did the

902
00:34:11,510 --> 00:34:08,480
research was a chapter ivan bunn

903
00:34:13,589 --> 00:34:11,520
who plotted the sightings of black dogs

904
00:34:15,829 --> 00:34:13,599
in folklore

905
00:34:17,190 --> 00:34:15,839
along the rivers of east anglia which is

906
00:34:20,710 --> 00:34:17,200
the eastern

907
00:34:22,629 --> 00:34:20,720
coast of britain and he found an

908
00:34:23,270 --> 00:34:22,639
absolute correlation between sightings

909
00:34:27,190 --> 00:34:23,280
of

910
00:34:29,349 --> 00:34:27,200
black dogs along these watercourses

911
00:34:32,389 --> 00:34:29,359
and again you wonder if the sort of the

912
00:34:35,990 --> 00:34:32,399
winding meandering

913
00:34:38,349 --> 00:34:36,000
paths of little streams and rivers

914
00:34:39,669 --> 00:34:38,359
would precipitate perhaps a

915
00:34:44,149 --> 00:34:39,679
complementary

916
00:34:47,430 --> 00:34:44,159
yang figure in the form of a dog

917
00:34:48,230 --> 00:34:47,440
this is a very very good idea as you can

918
00:34:51,270 --> 00:34:48,240
see but

919
00:34:53,349 --> 00:34:51,280
it's interesting that these i mean you

920
00:34:57,349 --> 00:34:53,359
just have to follow up every clue

921
00:34:57,910 --> 00:34:57,359
you can i could give the example for

922
00:35:01,109 --> 00:34:57,920
example

923
00:35:05,589 --> 00:35:01,119
of a friend of mine

924
00:35:08,790 --> 00:35:05,599
jonathan mcgowan who encountered a puma

925
00:35:10,150 --> 00:35:08,800
on a bridge over a river when i say puma

926
00:35:12,310 --> 00:35:10,160
it was one of these creatures but it

927
00:35:14,829 --> 00:35:12,320
wasn't like it was brown

928
00:35:16,230 --> 00:35:14,839
and as he ran towards it it ran towards

929
00:35:19,589 --> 00:35:16,240
him

930
00:35:22,790 --> 00:35:19,599
and when he got to the bridge

931
00:35:25,109 --> 00:35:22,800
it just vanished into thin air but what

932
00:35:27,990 --> 00:35:25,119
it had left on the bridge was a wet

933
00:35:29,990 --> 00:35:28,000
paw print just unmistakably that of a

934
00:35:32,790 --> 00:35:30,000
big cat

935
00:35:33,750 --> 00:35:32,800
so you can see that they whatever you

936
00:35:36,630 --> 00:35:33,760
can say about

937
00:35:38,230 --> 00:35:36,640
mystery big cats you can also say the

938
00:35:41,349 --> 00:35:38,240
opposite which is

939
00:35:45,030 --> 00:35:41,359
absolutely typical of the demonic world

940
00:35:46,790 --> 00:35:45,040
and absolutely suited to patrick as a

941
00:35:50,630 --> 00:35:46,800
subject because

942
00:35:56,950 --> 00:35:54,230
stop it leave me alone will you

943
00:35:58,069 --> 00:35:56,960
it's interesting that it is possible to

944
00:36:00,470 --> 00:35:58,079
correlate certain

945
00:36:01,190 --> 00:36:00,480
creatures with certain topographies for

946
00:36:04,790 --> 00:36:01,200
instance

947
00:36:07,109 --> 00:36:04,800
lake monsters there are

948
00:36:09,270 --> 00:36:07,119
hundreds of sightings of lake monsters

949
00:36:10,950 --> 00:36:09,280
often in quite small and unpromising

950
00:36:12,150 --> 00:36:10,960
lakes you know which wouldn't be deep

951
00:36:14,950 --> 00:36:12,160
enough to accommodate

952
00:36:15,990 --> 00:36:14,960
a monster yet you see them and you could

953
00:36:18,790 --> 00:36:16,000
even argue that

954
00:36:20,390 --> 00:36:18,800
bigfoot or sasquatch has its own special

955
00:36:24,630 --> 00:36:20,400
terrain as well

956
00:36:28,069 --> 00:36:24,640
mountains particularly and forests

957
00:36:29,430 --> 00:36:28,079
or both you know but

958
00:36:31,430 --> 00:36:29,440
you know we don't have that sort of

959
00:36:33,990 --> 00:36:31,440
dramatic we don't have

960
00:36:34,550 --> 00:36:34,000
vast lakes in the british isles we don't

961
00:36:40,550 --> 00:36:34,560
have

962
00:36:41,910 --> 00:36:40,560
vast forests so it's more difficult to

963
00:36:45,109 --> 00:36:41,920
correlate

964
00:36:46,550 --> 00:36:45,119
this sort of it's more difficult to say

965
00:36:48,710 --> 00:36:46,560
that these cats are

966
00:36:51,349 --> 00:36:48,720
connected to nature or our nature

967
00:36:53,349 --> 00:36:51,359
spirits in some sense

968
00:36:55,270 --> 00:36:53,359
so it's difficult to know to revert to

969
00:36:59,589 --> 00:36:55,280
your question

970
00:37:02,550 --> 00:36:59,599
why cats it's very difficult to know

971
00:37:04,470 --> 00:37:02,560
it's tempting to say something like if

972
00:37:05,589 --> 00:37:04,480
you live in a small country that is

973
00:37:09,190 --> 00:37:05,599
overtame

974
00:37:11,510 --> 00:37:09,200
and over civilized it will throw up

975
00:37:12,790 --> 00:37:11,520
some a bit like the young the repressed

976
00:37:16,790 --> 00:37:12,800
unconscious

977
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:16,800
will throw up some vivid and

978
00:37:23,190 --> 00:37:20,160
dangerous and exciting

979
00:37:23,910 --> 00:37:23,200
wild creature and it may be that that's

980
00:37:27,430 --> 00:37:23,920
the case

981
00:37:30,630 --> 00:37:27,440
but why black cats we don't know

982
00:37:32,390 --> 00:37:30,640
except that perhaps their very blackness

983
00:37:34,950 --> 00:37:32,400
and their very strangeness their very

984
00:37:36,790 --> 00:37:34,960
alienness

985
00:37:38,390 --> 00:37:36,800
is designed to show us that they're not

986
00:37:40,310 --> 00:37:38,400
just

987
00:37:42,230 --> 00:37:40,320
natural creatures you know that there is

988
00:37:43,510 --> 00:37:42,240
something that they resemble natural

989
00:37:45,589 --> 00:37:43,520
creatures

990
00:37:46,870 --> 00:37:45,599
but there is also something supernatural

991
00:37:49,589 --> 00:37:46,880
about them

992
00:37:50,150 --> 00:37:49,599
but right be honest you know if you try

993
00:37:53,430 --> 00:37:50,160
and say

994
00:37:55,829 --> 00:37:53,440
why cats and why there

995
00:37:59,349 --> 00:37:55,839
you're clutching at straws or clutching

996
00:38:01,190 --> 00:37:59,359
in merely's case of taoism you know

997
00:38:02,630 --> 00:38:01,200
which is fair enough but you know it's

998
00:38:06,230 --> 00:38:02,640
fair enough but

999
00:38:08,069 --> 00:38:06,240
it's hard to know you know yes

1000
00:38:09,750 --> 00:38:08,079
it's hard to find logic and things that

1001
00:38:11,190 --> 00:38:09,760
don't play by the rules

1002
00:38:13,190 --> 00:38:11,200
for all we know maybe they actually

1003
00:38:15,750 --> 00:38:13,200
think they're blending in by appearing

1004
00:38:17,430 --> 00:38:15,760
as animals we can really only guess

1005
00:38:19,109 --> 00:38:17,440
but i like the idea that they're

1006
00:38:22,630 --> 00:38:19,119
invoking some sort of

1007
00:38:24,310 --> 00:38:22,640
initiation by being just outside of what

1008
00:38:26,390 --> 00:38:24,320
is considered normal

1009
00:38:28,870 --> 00:38:26,400
so if you have the eyes to see if you

1010
00:38:31,589 --> 00:38:28,880
reflect on the experience deeply

1011
00:38:32,630 --> 00:38:31,599
you are led down a deeper path of

1012
00:38:34,550 --> 00:38:32,640
inquiry

1013
00:38:37,190 --> 00:38:34,560
and merrily makes an interesting

1014
00:38:38,710 --> 00:38:37,200
suggestion at one point that because we

1015
00:38:41,430 --> 00:38:38,720
don't believe in this stuff anymore

1016
00:38:43,910 --> 00:38:41,440
because we don't give it our respect

1017
00:38:46,390 --> 00:38:43,920
like we might have in previous ages

1018
00:38:48,390 --> 00:38:46,400
they can actually attract more of our

1019
00:38:50,069 --> 00:38:48,400
attention by appearing as an

1020
00:38:51,829 --> 00:38:50,079
out-of-place animal

1021
00:38:53,950 --> 00:38:51,839
because of course that is when they do

1022
00:38:55,589 --> 00:38:53,960
prompt police hunts and deeper

1023
00:38:57,829 --> 00:38:55,599
investigations

1024
00:39:00,550 --> 00:38:57,839
more so than if someone said they saw a

1025
00:39:02,550 --> 00:39:00,560
fairy or a mothman of some kind

1026
00:39:04,790 --> 00:39:02,560
the current culture wouldn't spring into

1027
00:39:06,390 --> 00:39:04,800
action in the same way as they do for a

1028
00:39:09,670 --> 00:39:06,400
big cat sighting

1029
00:39:11,670 --> 00:39:09,680
so if our conscious attention or energy

1030
00:39:14,390 --> 00:39:11,680
is a type of currency they consider

1031
00:39:15,430 --> 00:39:14,400
valuable it's not a bad form to take

1032
00:39:18,230 --> 00:39:15,440
because

1033
00:39:19,349 --> 00:39:18,240
it's not as big of a stretch for a big

1034
00:39:21,510 --> 00:39:19,359
cat to be out there

1035
00:39:23,990 --> 00:39:21,520
and it's also something people consider

1036
00:39:25,910 --> 00:39:24,000
dangerous to just leave alone

1037
00:39:28,630 --> 00:39:25,920
so they engage with it they go looking

1038
00:39:29,750 --> 00:39:28,640
for it they're more prone to explore

1039
00:39:32,069 --> 00:39:29,760
and i thought that was a pretty

1040
00:39:35,670 --> 00:39:32,079
interesting take yeah

1041
00:39:39,589 --> 00:39:35,680
exactly greg they're sort of enough like

1042
00:39:42,870 --> 00:39:39,599
a recognizable animal

1043
00:39:45,829 --> 00:39:42,880
to attract the attention and yet

1044
00:39:46,550 --> 00:39:45,839
they're elusive enough to drive you

1045
00:39:50,310 --> 00:39:46,560
nutty

1046
00:39:53,430 --> 00:39:50,320
you know what i mean after i'd

1047
00:39:55,430 --> 00:39:53,440
been researching it for a while

1048
00:39:57,349 --> 00:39:55,440
i found that i've managed to discuss

1049
00:39:58,790 --> 00:39:57,359
most of the facts and fallacies about

1050
00:40:00,150 --> 00:39:58,800
mystery big cats

1051
00:40:01,910 --> 00:40:00,160
you know i could see that they weren't

1052
00:40:05,349 --> 00:40:01,920
escaped pets

1053
00:40:08,390 --> 00:40:05,359
they weren't an indigenous species

1054
00:40:10,550 --> 00:40:08,400
and i thought after a while that i'd

1055
00:40:13,750 --> 00:40:10,560
come to the end really i couldn't think

1056
00:40:16,870 --> 00:40:13,760
what what else to think about them

1057
00:40:19,990 --> 00:40:16,880
except that after a while

1058
00:40:22,950 --> 00:40:20,000
i think everybody who investigates these

1059
00:40:26,309 --> 00:40:22,960
creatures and i would include

1060
00:40:28,470 --> 00:40:26,319
bigfoot in this people start to smell a

1061
00:40:31,270 --> 00:40:28,480
rat

1062
00:40:33,109 --> 00:40:31,280
and you get the feeling that you're kind

1063
00:40:36,390 --> 00:40:33,119
of being played with that you're being

1064
00:40:42,950 --> 00:40:40,390
and i started to wonder whether in fact

1065
00:40:44,870 --> 00:40:42,960
the whole point about their trickiness

1066
00:40:47,910 --> 00:40:44,880
the difficulty one has

1067
00:40:50,870 --> 00:40:47,920
in pinning them down in any way you know

1068
00:40:52,710 --> 00:40:50,880
even the forms they take aren't

1069
00:40:54,309 --> 00:40:52,720
consistent

1070
00:40:56,790 --> 00:40:54,319
and you start to wonder whether it's

1071
00:41:00,230 --> 00:40:56,800
this very trickiness

1072
00:41:03,430 --> 00:41:00,240
that has the significance and whether

1073
00:41:05,990 --> 00:41:03,440
their ambiguity could be the key

1074
00:41:09,349 --> 00:41:06,000
rather than the obstruction to

1075
00:41:11,430 --> 00:41:09,359
understanding the whole phenomenon

1076
00:41:13,109 --> 00:41:11,440
and of course that's where i derive

1077
00:41:16,550 --> 00:41:13,119
great

1078
00:41:19,829 --> 00:41:16,560
insight from pat's books that

1079
00:41:22,950 --> 00:41:19,839
this is the whole point of davin's

1080
00:41:26,309 --> 00:41:22,960
is that they confuse you

1081
00:41:27,030 --> 00:41:26,319
and they offer you you know when you

1082
00:41:28,870 --> 00:41:27,040
finally

1083
00:41:30,870 --> 00:41:28,880
think you're going to go mad they offer

1084
00:41:34,230 --> 00:41:30,880
you a really a different perspective

1085
00:41:35,589 --> 00:41:34,240
on what reality is

1086
00:41:38,309 --> 00:41:35,599
every time you think you've put your

1087
00:41:38,870 --> 00:41:38,319
finger on it they've squeezed out from

1088
00:41:41,109 --> 00:41:38,880
under that

1089
00:41:43,430 --> 00:41:41,119
that finger you know every time you

1090
00:41:45,829 --> 00:41:43,440
encounter that big cat on the riverbank

1091
00:41:47,589 --> 00:41:45,839
you look down for one minute and it's

1092
00:41:50,069 --> 00:41:47,599
gone

1093
00:41:52,390 --> 00:41:50,079
even photographs are always interesting

1094
00:41:55,430 --> 00:41:52,400
all photographs of diamonds

1095
00:41:57,430 --> 00:41:55,440
are as kind of just slightly

1096
00:41:59,430 --> 00:41:57,440
none of them are quite as clear as you

1097
00:42:01,349 --> 00:41:59,440
want them to be

1098
00:42:03,030 --> 00:42:01,359
there are photographs of bigfoot there

1099
00:42:09,589 --> 00:42:03,040
are photographs of

1100
00:42:12,710 --> 00:42:09,599
but none of them are unequivocal

1101
00:42:15,270 --> 00:42:12,720
you know they're always

1102
00:42:17,829 --> 00:42:15,280
if they're too clear they usually turn

1103
00:42:19,990 --> 00:42:17,839
out to be fakes

1104
00:42:21,589 --> 00:42:20,000
it's almost as if the diamonds know how

1105
00:42:24,630 --> 00:42:21,599
to be photographed

1106
00:42:27,910 --> 00:42:24,640
to increase the mystery to remain as

1107
00:42:29,990 --> 00:42:27,920
blurry and as ambiguous as the actual

1108
00:42:32,230 --> 00:42:30,000
sighting itself

1109
00:42:33,510 --> 00:42:32,240
absolutely there are several photos in

1110
00:42:36,710 --> 00:42:33,520
the book that are

1111
00:42:37,270 --> 00:42:36,720
impressive but as you say just shy of a

1112
00:42:39,990 --> 00:42:37,280
real

1113
00:42:41,109 --> 00:42:40,000
obvious smoking gun kind of image still

1114
00:42:42,710 --> 00:42:41,119
cool though

1115
00:42:44,230 --> 00:42:42,720
but another question that i think might

1116
00:42:46,230 --> 00:42:44,240
be on people's minds

1117
00:42:47,349 --> 00:42:46,240
would be if there has been any sort of

1118
00:42:50,150 --> 00:42:47,359
follow-up or

1119
00:42:52,390 --> 00:42:50,160
investigation done to look for

1120
00:42:54,630 --> 00:42:52,400
similarities in the lives of people

1121
00:42:56,870 --> 00:42:54,640
following one of these sightings could

1122
00:42:57,270 --> 00:42:56,880
they be an omen or a warning of some

1123
00:42:59,990 --> 00:42:57,280
kind

1124
00:43:00,710 --> 00:43:00,000
these people tend to suffer a tragedy in

1125
00:43:03,190 --> 00:43:00,720
the weeks

1126
00:43:04,790 --> 00:43:03,200
after a sighting things like that

1127
00:43:05,750 --> 00:43:04,800
obviously that was a theme with the

1128
00:43:08,550 --> 00:43:05,760
mothman

1129
00:43:10,710 --> 00:43:08,560
and i talked to mike clelland previously

1130
00:43:14,550 --> 00:43:10,720
about weird owl sightings that

1131
00:43:17,190 --> 00:43:14,560
tend to shapeshift maybe another demonic

1132
00:43:19,670 --> 00:43:17,200
manifestation but harbinger of doom talk

1133
00:43:21,430 --> 00:43:19,680
does come up in conversations

1134
00:43:23,430 --> 00:43:21,440
surrounding this sort of stuff

1135
00:43:25,589 --> 00:43:23,440
i wonder if we have any commonalities

1136
00:43:25,990 --> 00:43:25,599
among the people who have seen the big

1137
00:43:27,990 --> 00:43:26,000
cat

1138
00:43:29,270 --> 00:43:28,000
form and what it might have meant to

1139
00:43:31,030 --> 00:43:29,280
them

1140
00:43:33,270 --> 00:43:31,040
well it's interesting that you should

1141
00:43:36,870 --> 00:43:33,280
ask that actually greg because

1142
00:43:39,030 --> 00:43:36,880
the answer is broadly no

1143
00:43:41,829 --> 00:43:39,040
the black dogs of folklore are generally

1144
00:43:45,349 --> 00:43:41,839
regarded as an omen

1145
00:43:47,109 --> 00:43:45,359
of death or this or that or the other

1146
00:43:49,430 --> 00:43:47,119
particularly if they appear you know in

1147
00:43:52,630 --> 00:43:49,440
the house or in dreams

1148
00:43:53,190 --> 00:43:52,640
but as far as i know big cats don't

1149
00:43:56,630 --> 00:43:53,200
really

1150
00:43:59,990 --> 00:43:56,640
pressage anything other than

1151
00:44:01,349 --> 00:44:00,000
a complete change of life in the person

1152
00:44:04,470 --> 00:44:01,359
that's encountered them

1153
00:44:06,950 --> 00:44:04,480
in the sense that

1154
00:44:08,390 --> 00:44:06,960
they often say that they had been

1155
00:44:11,349 --> 00:44:08,400
skeptical

1156
00:44:12,870 --> 00:44:11,359
and what they had in fact incarnated was

1157
00:44:14,550 --> 00:44:12,880
a completely different

1158
00:44:16,790 --> 00:44:14,560
type of reality because they knew

1159
00:44:17,510 --> 00:44:16,800
perfectly well that there are no black

1160
00:44:20,230 --> 00:44:17,520
panthers

1161
00:44:20,630 --> 00:44:20,240
at large in england and yet what they

1162
00:44:23,990 --> 00:44:20,640
were

1163
00:44:24,870 --> 00:44:24,000
was looking at one and one chapter that

1164
00:44:28,309 --> 00:44:24,880
i quote in the book

1165
00:44:29,030 --> 00:44:28,319
mike cogan was absolutely astounded to

1166
00:44:31,829 --> 00:44:29,040
find one

1167
00:44:33,829 --> 00:44:31,839
running ahead of his car just a few feet

1168
00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:33,839
ahead of it and he saw that it was a

1169
00:44:38,390 --> 00:44:36,560
black panther a huge creature and he was

1170
00:44:40,390 --> 00:44:38,400
absolutely terrified but he noticed that

1171
00:44:43,349 --> 00:44:40,400
it was chasing a rabbit

1172
00:44:45,109 --> 00:44:43,359
and he said well you know i did see that

1173
00:44:47,109 --> 00:44:45,119
black panther as clear as anything it

1174
00:44:48,870 --> 00:44:47,119
was that's what it was a big cat

1175
00:44:50,390 --> 00:44:48,880
and he said i also saw the rabbit but i

1176
00:44:52,230 --> 00:44:50,400
saw the cat for longer than the rabbit

1177
00:44:54,390 --> 00:44:52,240
but nobody questions whether or not i

1178
00:44:56,150 --> 00:44:54,400
had seen a rabbit

1179
00:44:58,550 --> 00:44:56,160
yeah yeah that is a fair point for him

1180
00:44:59,430 --> 00:44:58,560
to make i think when you mentioned

1181
00:45:01,990 --> 00:44:59,440
initiation

1182
00:45:04,390 --> 00:45:02,000
earlier that you as you know greg that's

1183
00:45:07,109 --> 00:45:04,400
a subject close to my heart

1184
00:45:08,309 --> 00:45:07,119
and i think that might be something to

1185
00:45:11,349 --> 00:45:08,319
do with

1186
00:45:12,630 --> 00:45:11,359
all the appearances of diamonds but for

1187
00:45:15,750 --> 00:45:12,640
one blinding moment

1188
00:45:18,309 --> 00:45:15,760
people have a glimpse into something

1189
00:45:21,589 --> 00:45:18,319
they just can't get their heads round

1190
00:45:22,150 --> 00:45:21,599
and yet it's unquestionably real more

1191
00:45:25,510 --> 00:45:22,160
real than

1192
00:45:27,510 --> 00:45:25,520
everyday life and people remark not just

1193
00:45:30,309 --> 00:45:27,520
on the

1194
00:45:31,190 --> 00:45:30,319
natural nature of the as it were of the

1195
00:45:33,670 --> 00:45:31,200
big cats but

1196
00:45:36,230 --> 00:45:33,680
how sort of stunning they are how

1197
00:45:38,710 --> 00:45:36,240
beautiful they are how graceful they are

1198
00:45:40,150 --> 00:45:38,720
how glossy how shining you know it's

1199
00:45:44,950 --> 00:45:40,160
kind of like an epiphany

1200
00:45:47,349 --> 00:45:44,960
in many cases people you think they'd be

1201
00:45:48,630 --> 00:45:47,359
terrify but often they're not often they

1202
00:45:51,910 --> 00:45:48,640
just sort of stare at

1203
00:45:55,190 --> 00:45:51,920
the animal and the animal stares back

1204
00:45:58,870 --> 00:45:55,200
and the experience is one of awe

1205
00:45:59,990 --> 00:45:58,880
not of fright so it seems to take place

1206
00:46:02,630 --> 00:46:00,000
in its own space

1207
00:46:03,990 --> 00:46:02,640
as it were this encounter and people are

1208
00:46:07,270 --> 00:46:04,000
left

1209
00:46:07,990 --> 00:46:07,280
scarred by it their worldview has

1210
00:46:10,950 --> 00:46:08,000
shifted

1211
00:46:11,910 --> 00:46:10,960
it's been just pushed sideways i suppose

1212
00:46:14,230 --> 00:46:11,920
most people

1213
00:46:15,750 --> 00:46:14,240
forget it and carry on with their normal

1214
00:46:16,790 --> 00:46:15,760
lives but it's at the back of their

1215
00:46:18,309 --> 00:46:16,800
minds

1216
00:46:19,910 --> 00:46:18,319
but a lot of people don't a lot of

1217
00:46:23,430 --> 00:46:19,920
people

1218
00:46:24,790 --> 00:46:23,440
think more deeply about is the reality

1219
00:46:27,270 --> 00:46:24,800
we take for granted

1220
00:46:29,030 --> 00:46:27,280
the only reality or indeed the real

1221
00:46:30,710 --> 00:46:29,040
reality

1222
00:46:32,790 --> 00:46:30,720
yeah i mean that's a very good point

1223
00:46:34,790 --> 00:46:32,800
because

1224
00:46:36,710 --> 00:46:34,800
i'd say greg that the effect that these

1225
00:46:38,470 --> 00:46:36,720
creatures have on people

1226
00:46:39,829 --> 00:46:38,480
they're all struck very often and very

1227
00:46:43,030 --> 00:46:39,839
often they do

1228
00:46:43,750 --> 00:46:43,040
find them absolutely beautiful i quote

1229
00:46:47,270 --> 00:46:43,760
um

1230
00:46:50,150 --> 00:46:47,280
a couple called ray and evelyn robson

1231
00:46:51,430 --> 00:46:50,160
because they watched one of these black

1232
00:46:53,990 --> 00:46:51,440
panther type animals

1233
00:46:55,430 --> 00:46:54,000
strolling along a dry stone wall quite

1234
00:46:58,550 --> 00:46:55,440
close to them

1235
00:47:00,069 --> 00:46:58,560
and even said it was absolutely huge and

1236
00:47:03,670 --> 00:47:00,079
pure black

1237
00:47:06,069 --> 00:47:03,680
and ray said that's the gospel truth he

1238
00:47:08,870 --> 00:47:06,079
said my wife and i was so shocked

1239
00:47:10,710 --> 00:47:08,880
it had a beautiful shining fur coat it

1240
00:47:13,670 --> 00:47:10,720
was gorgeous

1241
00:47:15,990 --> 00:47:13,680
and another woman jan edwards saw

1242
00:47:18,069 --> 00:47:16,000
something very similar

1243
00:47:19,990 --> 00:47:18,079
and she said with the sun shining down

1244
00:47:22,309 --> 00:47:20,000
on on this creature

1245
00:47:24,549 --> 00:47:22,319
she said it looked like liquid velvet it

1246
00:47:27,750 --> 00:47:24,559
was absolutely beautiful

1247
00:47:28,309 --> 00:47:27,760
um people constantly say how beautiful

1248
00:47:31,430 --> 00:47:28,319
and

1249
00:47:34,950 --> 00:47:31,440
awesome these creatures are rippling

1250
00:47:37,670 --> 00:47:34,960
with health and muscular and with this

1251
00:47:39,030 --> 00:47:37,680
unbelievable shine on the fur which is

1252
00:47:39,510 --> 00:47:39,040
very interesting because you know a

1253
00:47:42,230 --> 00:47:39,520
leopard

1254
00:47:43,750 --> 00:47:42,240
doesn't shine in the same way it shows

1255
00:47:45,670 --> 00:47:43,760
up the rosette spots

1256
00:47:47,990 --> 00:47:45,680
behind the blackness if it's a

1257
00:47:51,589 --> 00:47:48,000
melonistic leopard

1258
00:47:55,430 --> 00:47:51,599
actually i do compare perhaps

1259
00:47:58,710 --> 00:47:55,440
rather weirdly black panthers

1260
00:48:01,910 --> 00:47:58,720
to men in black which are as you know

1261
00:48:05,270 --> 00:48:01,920
a feature of the ufo experience right

1262
00:48:08,150 --> 00:48:05,280
right because blackness is a sort of

1263
00:48:10,549 --> 00:48:08,160
feature of the men in black obviously

1264
00:48:14,790 --> 00:48:10,559
and it's very much a feature of

1265
00:48:16,950 --> 00:48:14,800
these panther-like animals in britain

1266
00:48:19,030 --> 00:48:16,960
yeah that's a worthy thing to note it's

1267
00:48:22,150 --> 00:48:19,040
a big theme with this stuff men in black

1268
00:48:25,190 --> 00:48:22,160
black-eyed children shadow figures

1269
00:48:26,069 --> 00:48:25,200
it seems to just relate to the void and

1270
00:48:28,309 --> 00:48:26,079
the dark

1271
00:48:30,390 --> 00:48:28,319
not so clear quality to all this stuff

1272
00:48:34,710 --> 00:48:30,400
and the overall mystery

1273
00:48:36,950 --> 00:48:34,720
yeah i mean i couldn't help but notice

1274
00:48:38,870 --> 00:48:36,960
the interesting sort of correlations the

1275
00:48:41,190 --> 00:48:38,880
fact that

1276
00:48:43,270 --> 00:48:41,200
you know men in black have old-fashioned

1277
00:48:45,670 --> 00:48:43,280
suits and

1278
00:48:47,270 --> 00:48:45,680
they have the slick for hairstyle of the

1279
00:48:49,270 --> 00:48:47,280
1950s

1280
00:48:53,910 --> 00:48:49,280
they're very you know shiny hair and

1281
00:48:58,230 --> 00:48:56,230
you know they're black and they're

1282
00:49:01,829 --> 00:48:58,240
polished and they're shiny

1283
00:49:04,390 --> 00:49:01,839
much in the way that the big cats are

1284
00:49:05,670 --> 00:49:04,400
you know once this idea had come to me i

1285
00:49:07,670 --> 00:49:05,680
thought well you know one of the

1286
00:49:09,510 --> 00:49:07,680
striking features about men in black is

1287
00:49:11,270 --> 00:49:09,520
that they're incompetent

1288
00:49:12,950 --> 00:49:11,280
you know you have to show them how to

1289
00:49:14,870 --> 00:49:12,960
eat food and

1290
00:49:17,270 --> 00:49:14,880
they never know what to do they're

1291
00:49:20,470 --> 00:49:17,280
clumsy as though they're not at home

1292
00:49:25,349 --> 00:49:20,480
in this world and so i

1293
00:49:27,589 --> 00:49:25,359
i sort of re-read my data to see if

1294
00:49:28,790 --> 00:49:27,599
mystery big cats could have something of

1295
00:49:31,910 --> 00:49:28,800
that

1296
00:49:32,470 --> 00:49:31,920
incompetence about them and sure enough

1297
00:49:35,990 --> 00:49:32,480
they do

1298
00:49:37,670 --> 00:49:36,000
they behave very strangely oddly

1299
00:49:39,030 --> 00:49:37,680
when people encounter them they often

1300
00:49:41,109 --> 00:49:39,040
are running

1301
00:49:43,109 --> 00:49:41,119
but running hunkered down close to the

1302
00:49:45,030 --> 00:49:43,119
ground which is a strange way of doing

1303
00:49:48,710 --> 00:49:45,040
it and sometimes they

1304
00:49:51,750 --> 00:49:48,720
are wandering along oblivious of their

1305
00:49:54,069 --> 00:49:51,760
surroundings you say they're in a dream

1306
00:49:55,030 --> 00:49:54,079
and sometimes they're running as if

1307
00:49:58,230 --> 00:49:55,040
they're caring

1308
00:50:00,230 --> 00:49:58,240
from something that you can't see

1309
00:50:01,670 --> 00:50:00,240
but very often they give the impression

1310
00:50:04,950 --> 00:50:01,680
of mimicking

1311
00:50:07,190 --> 00:50:04,960
the purposeful actions of biological big

1312
00:50:08,870 --> 00:50:07,200
cats but without a purpose in mind

1313
00:50:10,829 --> 00:50:08,880
rather in the way that men in black are

1314
00:50:14,150 --> 00:50:10,839
sort of seem to be

1315
00:50:17,910 --> 00:50:14,160
mimicking the activities of

1316
00:50:24,309 --> 00:50:21,430
but not very successfully kind of

1317
00:50:25,510 --> 00:50:24,319
i thought that was interesting very much

1318
00:50:26,950 --> 00:50:25,520
so the mimic

1319
00:50:28,630 --> 00:50:26,960
quality was something i was going to ask

1320
00:50:29,190 --> 00:50:28,640
you about because it seems like there

1321
00:50:31,510 --> 00:50:29,200
are

1322
00:50:33,030 --> 00:50:31,520
animal carcasses in the wake of some of

1323
00:50:34,950 --> 00:50:33,040
these big cats and obviously

1324
00:50:36,870 --> 00:50:34,960
experts can tell the difference between

1325
00:50:39,030 --> 00:50:36,880
prey that's been killed by a wolf or a

1326
00:50:41,109 --> 00:50:39,040
dog versus a wild feline

1327
00:50:42,630 --> 00:50:41,119
they go about the process in totally

1328
00:50:44,390 --> 00:50:42,640
different ways

1329
00:50:45,910 --> 00:50:44,400
and as you say in the book sometimes

1330
00:50:48,309 --> 00:50:45,920
these carcasses are even

1331
00:50:49,349 --> 00:50:48,319
up in trees which is clearly a big cat

1332
00:50:51,109 --> 00:50:49,359
thing

1333
00:50:53,030 --> 00:50:51,119
but it's a little weird for them to do

1334
00:50:53,670 --> 00:50:53,040
that and it starts making me think that

1335
00:50:56,390 --> 00:50:53,680
maybe my

1336
00:50:57,109 --> 00:50:56,400
concept of what a diamond is could be a

1337
00:50:58,549 --> 00:50:57,119
bit off

1338
00:51:00,549 --> 00:50:58,559
because i tend to think of them as

1339
00:51:02,230 --> 00:51:00,559
higher spirits that are just taking the

1340
00:51:05,030 --> 00:51:02,240
shape of an animal

1341
00:51:06,230 --> 00:51:05,040
as a mask of some kind embodying that

1342
00:51:08,069 --> 00:51:06,240
thing

1343
00:51:10,870 --> 00:51:08,079
but when we talk about them actually

1344
00:51:12,150 --> 00:51:10,880
carrying out wild animal behavior then

1345
00:51:14,549 --> 00:51:12,160
it gets a bit fuzzier

1346
00:51:16,390 --> 00:51:14,559
maybe they just do it because it's fun

1347
00:51:17,109 --> 00:51:16,400
but these situations do tend to be

1348
00:51:19,190 --> 00:51:17,119
described

1349
00:51:21,750 --> 00:51:19,200
as an encounter with something of a

1350
00:51:24,710 --> 00:51:21,760
higher than expected intelligence

1351
00:51:26,710 --> 00:51:24,720
with some human-like reactions and

1352
00:51:28,549 --> 00:51:26,720
aspects to their behavior

1353
00:51:30,950 --> 00:51:28,559
things like once they're seen the

1354
00:51:33,430 --> 00:51:30,960
creature will stop and stare back

1355
00:51:35,109 --> 00:51:33,440
and then make sure you see it disappear

1356
00:51:37,430 --> 00:51:35,119
into the brush

1357
00:51:40,069 --> 00:51:37,440
kind of like they have total awareness

1358
00:51:42,950 --> 00:51:40,079
and control over the experience so

1359
00:51:43,270 --> 00:51:42,960
it becomes hard to know what to think

1360
00:51:45,750 --> 00:51:43,280
yeah

1361
00:51:48,309 --> 00:51:45,760
exactly which isn't the natural behavior

1362
00:51:51,670 --> 00:51:48,319
of an actual wild animal particularly

1363
00:51:53,349 --> 00:51:51,680
uh they're very cool they stroll across

1364
00:51:54,710 --> 00:51:53,359
the road in front of cars and that's

1365
00:51:58,549 --> 00:51:54,720
another feature

1366
00:52:02,309 --> 00:51:58,559
of the sasquatch apparently yeah

1367
00:52:04,630 --> 00:52:02,319
where's germa and his guilt

1368
00:52:06,390 --> 00:52:04,640
they seem to wait till the car's nearly

1369
00:52:07,910 --> 00:52:06,400
upon them and then they cross the road

1370
00:52:10,230 --> 00:52:07,920
and that's very much a feature of the

1371
00:52:12,710 --> 00:52:10,240
big cats

1372
00:52:15,190 --> 00:52:12,720
as if they want to be noticed yes as if

1373
00:52:17,589 --> 00:52:15,200
they definitely want to be negative

1374
00:52:18,710 --> 00:52:17,599
but what you are saying greg about the

1375
00:52:22,630 --> 00:52:18,720
kills

1376
00:52:25,750 --> 00:52:22,640
yeah they are associated with

1377
00:52:28,950 --> 00:52:25,760
sheep kills in particular in britain

1378
00:52:31,190 --> 00:52:28,960
and deer and there are various

1379
00:52:33,589 --> 00:52:31,200
photographs of poor animals that have

1380
00:52:35,030 --> 00:52:33,599
been killed in a very cat-like manner

1381
00:52:37,349 --> 00:52:35,040
which is to say

1382
00:52:38,790 --> 00:52:37,359
very unlike that of a dog a cat kills

1383
00:52:42,630 --> 00:52:38,800
very cleanly

1384
00:52:45,270 --> 00:52:42,640
know

1385
00:52:46,309 --> 00:52:45,280
tears at it randomly but a cat peels

1386
00:52:48,710 --> 00:52:46,319
back the skin

1387
00:52:49,910 --> 00:52:48,720
and in case of a sheep the fleece which

1388
00:52:53,510 --> 00:52:49,920
i dare say

1389
00:52:55,910 --> 00:52:53,520
isn't very palatable and eats it from

1390
00:52:56,790 --> 00:52:55,920
inside very neatly without tearing

1391
00:53:00,390 --> 00:52:56,800
randomly at

1392
00:53:02,230 --> 00:53:00,400
the skin you know many many

1393
00:53:03,910 --> 00:53:02,240
farmers have lost sheep and they

1394
00:53:04,870 --> 00:53:03,920
attribute that to big cats that have

1395
00:53:08,069 --> 00:53:04,880
seen

1396
00:53:10,549 --> 00:53:08,079
on their land but

1397
00:53:12,630 --> 00:53:10,559
one of the features also is usually very

1398
00:53:15,910 --> 00:53:12,640
little blood on the ground

1399
00:53:19,270 --> 00:53:15,920
and that's a feature also of demonic

1400
00:53:23,430 --> 00:53:19,280
predation because of course blood is one

1401
00:53:26,309 --> 00:53:23,440
of the most demonic of substances

1402
00:53:27,270 --> 00:53:26,319
it occurs in myth even doesn't it and

1403
00:53:31,109 --> 00:53:27,280
i'm gonna

1404
00:53:34,230 --> 00:53:31,119
let pat describe hercules is summoning

1405
00:53:36,470 --> 00:53:34,240
of filling trenches with blood come on

1406
00:53:38,230 --> 00:53:36,480
you know that one oh well you know blood

1407
00:53:41,430 --> 00:53:38,240
is the life force and so on and

1408
00:53:43,910 --> 00:53:41,440
when heracles wanted to talk to the dead

1409
00:53:45,349 --> 00:53:43,920
he filled a trench with blood and

1410
00:53:47,670 --> 00:53:45,359
summoned the dead and

1411
00:53:49,990 --> 00:53:47,680
they couldn't speak until they'd taken a

1412
00:53:52,790 --> 00:53:50,000
mouthful of blood from out of the trench

1413
00:53:54,230 --> 00:53:52,800
and then he could question so you know

1414
00:53:57,109 --> 00:53:54,240
the idea of

1415
00:53:57,990 --> 00:53:57,119
blood and blood sacrifice and so on is

1416
00:54:00,309 --> 00:53:58,000
too ancient

1417
00:54:01,670 --> 00:54:00,319
and too widespread or too complicated to

1418
00:54:04,390 --> 00:54:01,680
go into

1419
00:54:04,870 --> 00:54:04,400
i wouldn't go down that route myself no

1420
00:54:06,630 --> 00:54:04,880
well

1421
00:54:08,549 --> 00:54:06,640
i don't really go down that route at all

1422
00:54:10,230 --> 00:54:08,559
but

1423
00:54:12,309 --> 00:54:10,240
i mean human flesh is pretty much a

1424
00:54:15,670 --> 00:54:12,319
demonic substance itself

1425
00:54:18,390 --> 00:54:15,680
you know mysterious scars appear on it

1426
00:54:19,349 --> 00:54:18,400
and certainly there have been people who

1427
00:54:22,790 --> 00:54:19,359
have encountered

1428
00:54:25,030 --> 00:54:22,800
a mystery big cat sometimes do fall foul

1429
00:54:28,230 --> 00:54:25,040
of them and find

1430
00:54:28,950 --> 00:54:28,240
that they have been damaged one woman

1431
00:54:31,510 --> 00:54:28,960
found

1432
00:54:32,309 --> 00:54:31,520
she was leaving well a big cat knocked

1433
00:54:34,390 --> 00:54:32,319
her over let's

1434
00:54:36,549 --> 00:54:34,400
put it this way but she didn't think it

1435
00:54:38,150 --> 00:54:36,559
had in any way hurt her

1436
00:54:40,390 --> 00:54:38,160
until she got undressed that night and

1437
00:54:43,750 --> 00:54:40,400
she found three

1438
00:54:45,750 --> 00:54:43,760
slash marks on her ribs

1439
00:54:46,950 --> 00:54:45,760
her coat hadn't even been torn so how

1440
00:54:50,390 --> 00:54:46,960
they got there

1441
00:54:52,710 --> 00:54:50,400
nobody knows but that's a rather

1442
00:54:55,270 --> 00:54:52,720
sinister aspect of

1443
00:54:57,270 --> 00:54:55,280
the demonic world is that they can

1444
00:54:59,910 --> 00:54:57,280
actually

1445
00:55:00,390 --> 00:54:59,920
hurt you or mark you i should say not

1446
00:55:03,990 --> 00:55:00,400
hurt

1447
00:55:06,870 --> 00:55:04,000
mark through your clothes

1448
00:55:09,109 --> 00:55:06,880
it's a feature also of course abduction

1449
00:55:11,829 --> 00:55:09,119
experiences you know people are

1450
00:55:13,030 --> 00:55:11,839
left with abduction scars and so forth

1451
00:55:16,630 --> 00:55:13,040
yes

1452
00:55:20,390 --> 00:55:16,640
pat would would say any initiation

1453
00:55:21,910 --> 00:55:20,400
involves scarring in my book

1454
00:55:24,470 --> 00:55:21,920
diamond reality you know i have a

1455
00:55:27,430 --> 00:55:24,480
chapter called demonic traces

1456
00:55:28,549 --> 00:55:27,440
and sort of physical contact with

1457
00:55:32,309 --> 00:55:28,559
diamonds

1458
00:55:34,870 --> 00:55:32,319
is sort of a bit like the photographs

1459
00:55:36,150 --> 00:55:34,880
nothing is conclusive but they're kind

1460
00:55:38,950 --> 00:55:36,160
of there

1461
00:55:39,910 --> 00:55:38,960
but they're not that significant in

1462
00:55:42,549 --> 00:55:39,920
fairy law

1463
00:55:44,870 --> 00:55:42,559
you know a fairy will give you a what

1464
00:55:47,910 --> 00:55:44,880
the irish caller blasts

1465
00:55:49,910 --> 00:55:47,920
or will touch you and we get the idea of

1466
00:55:51,829 --> 00:55:49,920
being touched in the head from that

1467
00:55:55,349 --> 00:55:51,839
if you're touched by a fairy you know

1468
00:55:57,670 --> 00:55:55,359
you're a little bit barmy ever after

1469
00:55:59,349 --> 00:55:57,680
or you can be given a stroke by the

1470
00:56:01,990 --> 00:55:59,359
fairy and we still have

1471
00:56:03,670 --> 00:56:02,000
used that word today for people who are

1472
00:56:07,349 --> 00:56:03,680
paralyzed down one side

1473
00:56:10,870 --> 00:56:07,359
used to be attributed to being

1474
00:56:13,430 --> 00:56:10,880
struck by a fairy and

1475
00:56:15,270 --> 00:56:13,440
even if you encounter aliens from ufo

1476
00:56:17,910 --> 00:56:15,280
they can give you a nasty blast as well

1477
00:56:20,549 --> 00:56:17,920
can't you they have their ray guns and

1478
00:56:21,670 --> 00:56:20,559
you have rashes and you feel dizzy for

1479
00:56:24,309 --> 00:56:21,680
days afterwards

1480
00:56:25,990 --> 00:56:24,319
quite apart from the scars you get from

1481
00:56:28,870 --> 00:56:26,000
alien abductions

1482
00:56:30,630 --> 00:56:28,880
but big cats are the same where there's

1483
00:56:31,109 --> 00:56:30,640
a mystery big cats i mean wherever

1484
00:56:36,069 --> 00:56:31,119
there's

1485
00:56:38,950 --> 00:56:36,079
contact it's always surprisingly slight

1486
00:56:40,230 --> 00:56:38,960
if it were a leopard lepers are

1487
00:56:42,950 --> 00:56:40,240
unbelievably

1488
00:56:43,349 --> 00:56:42,960
powerful you can be walking along a road

1489
00:56:50,470 --> 00:56:43,359
in

1490
00:56:52,390 --> 00:56:50,480
as a boy you know i was picked up by a

1491
00:56:53,910 --> 00:56:52,400
man in the car who was white with shock

1492
00:56:56,150 --> 00:56:53,920
at the size of me doing it i was

1493
00:56:58,950 --> 00:56:56,160
hitchhiking around didn't know better

1494
00:57:00,710 --> 00:56:58,960
and you know he said you could be

1495
00:57:02,710 --> 00:57:00,720
walking with five people

1496
00:57:03,910 --> 00:57:02,720
and suddenly you'll notice there's only

1497
00:57:06,470 --> 00:57:03,920
four of you a leopard

1498
00:57:08,630 --> 00:57:06,480
can just take you completely silently

1499
00:57:10,630 --> 00:57:08,640
can kill you with one blow

1500
00:57:12,230 --> 00:57:10,640
and drag you up a tree before you can

1501
00:57:16,950 --> 00:57:12,240
turn around you know

1502
00:57:20,150 --> 00:57:16,960
so clearly these mystery big cats

1503
00:57:22,150 --> 00:57:20,160
there are scratches a man cycling

1504
00:57:24,710 --> 00:57:22,160
very near here in dorset actually down a

1505
00:57:25,190 --> 00:57:24,720
hill was knocked off his bicycle by a

1506
00:57:27,990 --> 00:57:25,200
big

1507
00:57:29,510 --> 00:57:28,000
cat who jumps out of the hedge if it had

1508
00:57:33,750 --> 00:57:29,520
been a leopard

1509
00:57:35,670 --> 00:57:33,760
you know he'd have been dead so

1510
00:57:37,510 --> 00:57:35,680
these sort of physical contacts rather

1511
00:57:41,030 --> 00:57:37,520
like the photographs

1512
00:57:42,789 --> 00:57:41,040
are suggestive rather than conclusive

1513
00:57:44,230 --> 00:57:42,799
you know and they always seem to be like

1514
00:57:46,789 --> 00:57:44,240
that

1515
00:57:47,670 --> 00:57:46,799
it just deepens the mystery rather than

1516
00:57:51,349 --> 00:57:47,680
providing

1517
00:57:51,910 --> 00:57:51,359
the evidence we all crave yes it speaks

1518
00:57:54,309 --> 00:57:51,920
to that

1519
00:57:56,549 --> 00:57:54,319
coaxing quality we mentioned it's just

1520
00:57:57,030 --> 00:57:56,559
enough to hook people but never enough

1521
00:57:59,750 --> 00:57:57,040
to

1522
00:58:01,510 --> 00:57:59,760
confirm and i just really like that idea

1523
00:58:02,630 --> 00:58:01,520
that maybe they take the form of these

1524
00:58:04,950 --> 00:58:02,640
big cats today

1525
00:58:06,309 --> 00:58:04,960
because it's a more strategically

1526
00:58:08,710 --> 00:58:06,319
effective hook

1527
00:58:10,150 --> 00:58:08,720
than something even more far out that we

1528
00:58:11,829 --> 00:58:10,160
can't even deal with

1529
00:58:13,829 --> 00:58:11,839
but patrick i'm curious to hear your

1530
00:58:15,750 --> 00:58:13,839
thoughts on where we might be with a

1531
00:58:18,710 --> 00:58:15,760
better understanding of these things

1532
00:58:19,990 --> 00:58:18,720
culturally because charles fort had this

1533
00:58:22,549 --> 00:58:20,000
theory that we'd go through

1534
00:58:23,430 --> 00:58:22,559
some different ages or dominance as he

1535
00:58:25,910 --> 00:58:23,440
said

1536
00:58:27,349 --> 00:58:25,920
a dominant of religion followed by a

1537
00:58:29,670 --> 00:58:27,359
dominant of science

1538
00:58:31,190 --> 00:58:29,680
those definitely seem to shake out but

1539
00:58:33,510 --> 00:58:31,200
then we'd enter a dominant of

1540
00:58:35,270 --> 00:58:33,520
wider inclusion where we bring back the

1541
00:58:38,549 --> 00:58:35,280
things we couldn't look at

1542
00:58:40,789 --> 00:58:38,559
through a purely scientific lens and

1543
00:58:42,630 --> 00:58:40,799
these are wide arcs of course who knows

1544
00:58:44,390 --> 00:58:42,640
where we are exactly or if it even

1545
00:58:45,990 --> 00:58:44,400
follows that pattern

1546
00:58:47,910 --> 00:58:46,000
and maybe i'm in a bit of a bubble

1547
00:58:50,150 --> 00:58:47,920
because i do shows like this

1548
00:58:51,670 --> 00:58:50,160
but it does feel like we're inching

1549
00:58:55,030 --> 00:58:51,680
closer to a

1550
00:58:57,030 --> 00:58:55,040
cultural curiosity if not acceptance of

1551
00:58:59,030 --> 00:58:57,040
this sort of stuff more so

1552
00:59:01,430 --> 00:58:59,040
than previous decades that i've been

1553
00:59:03,430 --> 00:59:01,440
around for what do you think

1554
00:59:04,950 --> 00:59:03,440
you'd know more about that than me since

1555
00:59:08,069 --> 00:59:04,960
i'm in a bubble of one

1556
00:59:10,390 --> 00:59:08,079
in rural dorset but

1557
00:59:11,109 --> 00:59:10,400
i mean the most outstanding change since

1558
00:59:14,390 --> 00:59:11,119
i wrote

1559
00:59:16,150 --> 00:59:14,400
demonic reality you know and

1560
00:59:19,190 --> 00:59:16,160
the most outstanding change has of

1561
00:59:23,190 --> 00:59:19,200
course been the internet

1562
00:59:26,390 --> 00:59:23,200
that you know the innumerable websites

1563
00:59:28,789 --> 00:59:26,400
which i mean when i was writing my book

1564
00:59:31,990 --> 00:59:28,799
i had to go to libraries and read books

1565
00:59:34,069 --> 00:59:32,000
and plagiarize and steal

1566
00:59:35,589 --> 00:59:34,079
first-person accounts from various books

1567
00:59:38,470 --> 00:59:35,599
you know it took forever

1568
00:59:40,309 --> 00:59:38,480
but now you get on the internet and the

1569
00:59:41,750 --> 00:59:40,319
actual people who've had the experience

1570
00:59:43,430 --> 00:59:41,760
are there

1571
00:59:45,670 --> 00:59:43,440
talking you know it's absolutely

1572
00:59:46,069 --> 00:59:45,680
fantastic for instance i'd never heard

1573
00:59:49,589 --> 00:59:46,079
of

1574
00:59:50,390 --> 00:59:49,599
dog men turns out there's a vast dogmen

1575
00:59:52,710 --> 00:59:50,400
culture

1576
00:59:54,069 --> 00:59:52,720
you know i got hooked on the dogmen

1577
00:59:56,549 --> 00:59:54,079
sites

1578
00:59:57,190 --> 00:59:56,559
these strange creatures who look exactly

1579
01:00:00,309 --> 00:59:57,200
like

1580
01:00:03,589 --> 01:00:00,319
the egyptian god anubis you know

1581
01:00:04,470 --> 01:00:03,599
dog-headed men and so i would say that

1582
01:00:07,510 --> 01:00:04,480
yes

1583
01:00:08,710 --> 01:00:07,520
awareness of the supernatural or of the

1584
01:00:11,510 --> 01:00:08,720
demonic

1585
01:00:12,470 --> 01:00:11,520
is much more widespread than it was

1586
01:00:14,710 --> 01:00:12,480
because we

1587
01:00:16,470 --> 01:00:14,720
don't just have books and there aren't

1588
01:00:17,670 --> 01:00:16,480
any fewer books that i think books are

1589
01:00:20,630 --> 01:00:17,680
proliferated

1590
01:00:21,349 --> 01:00:20,640
but we also have the vast resources of

1591
01:00:24,789 --> 01:00:21,359
the internet

1592
01:00:25,670 --> 01:00:24,799
and the thousands of mysterious websites

1593
01:00:27,670 --> 01:00:25,680
which

1594
01:00:30,470 --> 01:00:27,680
you could link from one to another and i

1595
01:00:33,510 --> 01:00:30,480
mean whole days go by when i find myself

1596
01:00:36,870 --> 01:00:33,520
sucked into i don't know

1597
01:00:39,349 --> 01:00:36,880
bigfoot websites dogman websites

1598
01:00:40,549 --> 01:00:39,359
ufo websites you know you could get

1599
01:00:43,109 --> 01:00:40,559
quite mad

1600
01:00:45,190 --> 01:00:43,119
so yeah so i think it is more more

1601
01:00:47,510 --> 01:00:45,200
widespread but i don't think it's any

1602
01:00:50,870 --> 01:00:47,520
more

1603
01:00:53,510 --> 01:00:50,880
converts

1604
01:00:54,470 --> 01:00:53,520
amongst the mainstream bodies if you see

1605
01:00:56,069 --> 01:00:54,480
what i mean

1606
01:00:57,510 --> 01:00:56,079
i don't think the scientists have

1607
01:00:58,230 --> 01:00:57,520
changed their attitude i don't think

1608
01:01:00,870 --> 01:00:58,240
they've

1609
01:01:02,789 --> 01:01:00,880
nobody's been recruited from religion or

1610
01:01:05,829 --> 01:01:02,799
science i don't think

1611
01:01:07,349 --> 01:01:05,839
or any more than they were in the past i

1612
01:01:09,349 --> 01:01:07,359
just think

1613
01:01:12,390 --> 01:01:09,359
there are a lot more ordinary people who

1614
01:01:15,670 --> 01:01:12,400
are aware of these things now

1615
01:01:17,510 --> 01:01:15,680
but whether they are intrigued by them

1616
01:01:18,069 --> 01:01:17,520
or go along with them or believe in them

1617
01:01:20,710 --> 01:01:18,079
or not

1618
01:01:24,069 --> 01:01:20,720
i just don't know i just don't know

1619
01:01:26,950 --> 01:01:24,079
maybe there's just always

1620
01:01:27,270 --> 01:01:26,960
only a certain number of people a lot

1621
01:01:31,109 --> 01:01:27,280
but

1622
01:01:34,309 --> 01:01:31,119
only a certain number who are just

1623
01:01:34,950 --> 01:01:34,319
intrigued by mystery as i was from a

1624
01:01:37,030 --> 01:01:34,960
child

1625
01:01:38,230 --> 01:01:37,040
you know when i heard about messages

1626
01:01:40,230 --> 01:01:38,240
from a child

1627
01:01:42,710 --> 01:01:40,240
i just couldn't get them out of my mind

1628
01:01:45,030 --> 01:01:42,720
i was fascinated you know

1629
01:01:46,630 --> 01:01:45,040
but a lot of my friends just they looked

1630
01:01:48,309 --> 01:01:46,640
blank they didn't say anything they

1631
01:01:49,270 --> 01:01:48,319
didn't i say isn't that mysterious

1632
01:01:52,950 --> 01:01:49,280
they'd go

1633
01:01:54,870 --> 01:01:52,960
well say what you know that's a reaction

1634
01:01:58,549 --> 01:01:54,880
i am quite familiar with

1635
01:02:01,510 --> 01:01:58,559
well guys looks like we did it two hours

1636
01:02:03,029 --> 01:02:01,520
talking largely about mystery big cats i

1637
01:02:06,150 --> 01:02:03,039
don't know what i was worried about it

1638
01:02:08,069 --> 01:02:06,160
really is a fascinating subject if you

1639
01:02:09,910 --> 01:02:08,079
want to explore these beings between the

1640
01:02:12,150 --> 01:02:09,920
worlds then you might as well talk about

1641
01:02:14,710 --> 01:02:12,160
them in their most common modern form

1642
01:02:15,510 --> 01:02:14,720
and that's the abcs before we go we

1643
01:02:18,069 --> 01:02:15,520
should certainly

1644
01:02:19,029 --> 01:02:18,079
remind the people of other works that

1645
01:02:20,870 --> 01:02:19,039
you guys have

1646
01:02:23,750 --> 01:02:20,880
written that they might be interested in

1647
01:02:25,910 --> 01:02:23,760
and any future plans for new books if

1648
01:02:28,549 --> 01:02:25,920
there are any let them know

1649
01:02:31,430 --> 01:02:28,559
oh well i no i am this is the new

1650
01:02:33,270 --> 01:02:31,440
edition of my book mystery big cats

1651
01:02:34,470 --> 01:02:33,280
greg but pat's got for you in the

1652
01:02:36,630 --> 01:02:34,480
pipeline haven't you

1653
01:02:38,390 --> 01:02:36,640
yeah this is merely show i'm not gonna

1654
01:02:41,109 --> 01:02:38,400
do any advertising greg

1655
01:02:42,390 --> 01:02:41,119
people could go to my website and feast

1656
01:02:44,309 --> 01:02:42,400
their eyes

1657
01:02:46,150 --> 01:02:44,319
fair enough it's a classy move but of

1658
01:02:49,029 --> 01:02:46,160
course it is all in the family

1659
01:02:50,549 --> 01:02:49,039
yeah true true true yeah yeah well i'll

1660
01:02:51,910 --> 01:02:50,559
do the ad for him if you go to his

1661
01:02:58,470 --> 01:02:51,920
website it's

1662
01:03:01,270 --> 01:02:58,480
what is it harper www.harper.org

1663
01:03:02,630 --> 01:03:01,280
patrick that's me you can see my books

1664
01:03:05,589 --> 01:03:02,640
there

1665
01:03:07,510 --> 01:03:05,599
now who are james and john harper other

1666
01:03:09,990 --> 01:03:07,520
sibling authors of yours

1667
01:03:11,670 --> 01:03:10,000
that's right right on they seem to have

1668
01:03:12,230 --> 01:03:11,680
some pretty interesting work out there

1669
01:03:16,309 --> 01:03:12,240
too

1670
01:03:19,029 --> 01:03:16,319
oh my brother james is a fantastic poet

1671
01:03:20,710 --> 01:03:19,039
a famous and acclaimed poet rightly so

1672
01:03:24,230 --> 01:03:20,720
and my other brother is a

1673
01:03:25,589 --> 01:03:24,240
fantastic man a wit raccoon tur and

1674
01:03:28,549 --> 01:03:25,599
gypsy

1675
01:03:30,309 --> 01:03:28,559
so yeah we live in their shadow really

1676
01:03:33,029 --> 01:03:30,319
we're just humble sort of

1677
01:03:34,870 --> 01:03:33,039
drudges you know writing churning up

1678
01:03:37,990 --> 01:03:34,880
books

1679
01:03:39,430 --> 01:03:38,000
and fabulous art but you know good stuff

1680
01:03:41,510 --> 01:03:39,440
who knew there were more than

1681
01:03:42,950 --> 01:03:41,520
just two interesting branches on the

1682
01:03:45,670 --> 01:03:42,960
harper tree

1683
01:03:47,589 --> 01:03:45,680
but it was a real pleasure patrick great

1684
01:03:49,990 --> 01:03:47,599
to talk to you again merrily

1685
01:03:51,029 --> 01:03:50,000
nice to make your acquaintance and i'm

1686
01:03:53,430 --> 01:03:51,039
glad patrick

1687
01:03:54,950 --> 01:03:53,440
showed me your revised edition of

1688
01:03:57,349 --> 01:03:54,960
mystery big cats

1689
01:03:58,789 --> 01:03:57,359
it was a lot of fun enjoy the rest of

1690
01:04:04,789 --> 01:03:58,799
your night guys

1691
01:04:08,470 --> 01:04:06,390
praise be to he good people of the

1692
01:04:12,470 --> 01:04:08,480
internet thc's return

1693
01:04:13,910 --> 01:04:12,480
to cryptozoology there we have it

1694
01:04:16,230 --> 01:04:13,920
this was one where when we did the

1695
01:04:17,430 --> 01:04:16,240
recording i was pretty worried that i

1696
01:04:18,950 --> 01:04:17,440
couldn't make it sound

1697
01:04:20,549 --> 01:04:18,960
good enough and i was gonna have to

1698
01:04:22,870 --> 01:04:20,559
trash it

1699
01:04:24,710 --> 01:04:22,880
i was even more convinced that i would

1700
01:04:27,270 --> 01:04:24,720
put a preface on it

1701
01:04:29,109 --> 01:04:27,280
warning people about the quality but

1702
01:04:31,190 --> 01:04:29,119
when i got it back from our editor

1703
01:04:33,109 --> 01:04:31,200
i didn't think we needed that of course

1704
01:04:34,549 --> 01:04:33,119
i kind of just skimmed around but i

1705
01:04:37,910 --> 01:04:34,559
didn't hear anything too

1706
01:04:41,029 --> 01:04:37,920
terrible especially when it's compared

1707
01:04:42,470 --> 01:04:41,039
to how i actually captured all of this

1708
01:04:44,789 --> 01:04:42,480
and

1709
01:04:45,990 --> 01:04:44,799
i can still tell that some of the

1710
01:04:48,630 --> 01:04:46,000
technical stuff

1711
01:04:50,150 --> 01:04:48,640
was distracting on their end a little

1712
01:04:52,549 --> 01:04:50,160
bit though

1713
01:04:53,349 --> 01:04:52,559
it is what it is i apologize to the

1714
01:04:55,589 --> 01:04:53,359
harpers

1715
01:04:57,589 --> 01:04:55,599
and i told you guys i am testing new

1716
01:04:59,829 --> 01:04:57,599
systems in july

1717
01:05:00,630 --> 01:04:59,839
i tried a new recording platform that

1718
01:05:03,510 --> 01:05:00,640
was just a bit

1719
01:05:05,109 --> 01:05:03,520
complicated on this one and of course i

1720
01:05:07,510 --> 01:05:05,119
can't really help over the line

1721
01:05:08,390 --> 01:05:07,520
i can't see what's going wrong on their

1722
01:05:11,190 --> 01:05:08,400
end but

1723
01:05:13,029 --> 01:05:11,200
i was hearing myself in a terrible echo

1724
01:05:14,549 --> 01:05:13,039
and we fumbled around with it for over

1725
01:05:16,069 --> 01:05:14,559
30 minutes

1726
01:05:18,710 --> 01:05:16,079
and eventually i just said you know

1727
01:05:21,589 --> 01:05:18,720
screw it let's record it and i will

1728
01:05:25,829 --> 01:05:21,599
sort it out later something every audio

1729
01:05:29,270 --> 01:05:28,789
looking back i think what happened is

1730
01:05:33,029 --> 01:05:29,280
they

1731
01:05:35,270 --> 01:05:33,039
used the link to join the session twice

1732
01:05:36,150 --> 01:05:35,280
so we had an audio version of that

1733
01:05:37,829 --> 01:05:36,160
effect where

1734
01:05:39,349 --> 01:05:37,839
you're in a bathroom with a mirror on

1735
01:05:41,430 --> 01:05:39,359
the wall in front of you and behind you

1736
01:05:44,150 --> 01:05:41,440
and there's just like this crazy

1737
01:05:45,829 --> 01:05:44,160
infinite visual echo i guess you could

1738
01:05:48,549 --> 01:05:45,839
call that

1739
01:05:50,789 --> 01:05:48,559
but long story short i spent many hours

1740
01:05:53,190 --> 01:05:50,799
chopping this up and separating all of

1741
01:05:55,589 --> 01:05:53,200
us onto our own tracks and boosting

1742
01:05:56,390 --> 01:05:55,599
merrily's levels and lowering mine and

1743
01:06:00,470 --> 01:05:56,400
patrick's

1744
01:06:01,829 --> 01:06:00,480
and uh basically just getting it as good

1745
01:06:05,029 --> 01:06:01,839
as i could before

1746
01:06:06,150 --> 01:06:05,039
sending it off to our editor who in turn

1747
01:06:09,190 --> 01:06:06,160
worked his magic

1748
01:06:09,589 --> 01:06:09,200
and sent it back even better i still

1749
01:06:11,990 --> 01:06:09,599
hear

1750
01:06:14,549 --> 01:06:12,000
some artifacts and some of the rustling

1751
01:06:16,069 --> 01:06:14,559
parts that really couldn't be fixed

1752
01:06:17,589 --> 01:06:16,079
but they were sitting on a couch

1753
01:06:19,510 --> 01:06:17,599
together sharing

1754
01:06:20,870 --> 01:06:19,520
one set of earbuds and again in

1755
01:06:23,990 --> 01:06:20,880
retrospect

1756
01:06:26,150 --> 01:06:24,000
my guess is that those earbuds had a

1757
01:06:27,589 --> 01:06:26,160
microphone on them like so many do and

1758
01:06:29,670 --> 01:06:27,599
when patrick would adjust

1759
01:06:31,430 --> 01:06:29,680
it he might have been touching the

1760
01:06:32,069 --> 01:06:31,440
microphone and didn't know it and that's

1761
01:06:34,630 --> 01:06:32,079
why it got

1762
01:06:36,549 --> 01:06:34,640
so crazy loud and that's why his voice

1763
01:06:38,950 --> 01:06:36,559
was so much louder than her voice

1764
01:06:39,670 --> 01:06:38,960
because he was right there up on it

1765
01:06:41,750 --> 01:06:39,680
these are my

1766
01:06:44,069 --> 01:06:41,760
guesses reverse engineering the issues

1767
01:06:44,470 --> 01:06:44,079
we were having and not being able to see

1768
01:06:47,349 --> 01:06:44,480
or

1769
01:06:49,349 --> 01:06:47,359
help them really all that much yes i'm

1770
01:06:50,309 --> 01:06:49,359
sure i will still get some complaints

1771
01:06:51,829 --> 01:06:50,319
but

1772
01:06:53,750 --> 01:06:51,839
they're not going to understand how far

1773
01:06:54,230 --> 01:06:53,760
we actually went to get this where it is

1774
01:06:57,510 --> 01:06:54,240
and that's

1775
01:06:59,349 --> 01:06:57,520
fine on the positive side the next two

1776
01:07:00,150 --> 01:06:59,359
episodes i already have recorded and

1777
01:07:02,710 --> 01:07:00,160
they sound

1778
01:07:03,589 --> 01:07:02,720
pretty much perfect i can close my eyes

1779
01:07:05,750 --> 01:07:03,599
and actually

1780
01:07:07,589 --> 01:07:05,760
think that we were in the same room and

1781
01:07:09,670 --> 01:07:07,599
i have nailed the program i'm going to

1782
01:07:13,349 --> 01:07:09,680
be using going forward and we are

1783
01:07:14,789 --> 01:07:13,359
off to the races but content-wise this

1784
01:07:17,150 --> 01:07:14,799
is one of the most

1785
01:07:18,950 --> 01:07:17,160
common requests i get to return to

1786
01:07:20,710 --> 01:07:18,960
cryptozoology

1787
01:07:22,150 --> 01:07:20,720
and when patrick said hey man i'm trying

1788
01:07:24,069 --> 01:07:22,160
to throw a little attention on my

1789
01:07:25,349 --> 01:07:24,079
sister's book would you be interested in

1790
01:07:27,349 --> 01:07:25,359
checking it out

1791
01:07:29,190 --> 01:07:27,359
i kind of roped him into joining us

1792
01:07:32,150 --> 01:07:29,200
since i really

1793
01:07:34,150 --> 01:07:32,160
loved his insights in the episode we did

1794
01:07:35,029 --> 01:07:34,160
and i think he's highlighting the most

1795
01:07:37,829 --> 01:07:35,039
appropriate

1796
01:07:39,910 --> 01:07:37,839
framework for these things but i also

1797
01:07:41,829 --> 01:07:39,920
did worry that it was a bit

1798
01:07:43,029 --> 01:07:41,839
light for a two-hour conversation i

1799
01:07:45,990 --> 01:07:43,039
thought it was maybe too

1800
01:07:47,589 --> 01:07:46,000
specific but you know i didn't really

1801
01:07:50,309 --> 01:07:47,599
feel that way after

1802
01:07:51,109 --> 01:07:50,319
actually reading the book i understand

1803
01:07:53,750 --> 01:07:51,119
that it can be

1804
01:07:56,069 --> 01:07:53,760
hard at first to shake the feeling that

1805
01:07:58,230 --> 01:07:56,079
it's just an undiscovered wild animal

1806
01:07:59,910 --> 01:07:58,240
out there which is why that was the

1807
01:08:02,150 --> 01:07:59,920
first thing i wanted to attack

1808
01:08:04,470 --> 01:08:02,160
so that this subject would keep your

1809
01:08:06,390 --> 01:08:04,480
interest a little bit better

1810
01:08:07,670 --> 01:08:06,400
with a little knowledge of real wild

1811
01:08:09,670 --> 01:08:07,680
cats it's pretty clear

1812
01:08:11,349 --> 01:08:09,680
this is something else plus the glowing

1813
01:08:13,270 --> 01:08:11,359
eyes and the fadeaways but

1814
01:08:15,430 --> 01:08:13,280
skeptics would just chalk that up to

1815
01:08:17,030 --> 01:08:15,440
witness error i guess

1816
01:08:18,950 --> 01:08:17,040
although it seems like a pretty hard

1817
01:08:21,669 --> 01:08:18,960
thing to get wrong

1818
01:08:24,229 --> 01:08:21,679
oh you're right the big cat didn't just

1819
01:08:27,669 --> 01:08:24,239
fade away in front of my eyes

1820
01:08:29,669 --> 01:08:27,679
my bad so i thought this was a fun topic

1821
01:08:31,030 --> 01:08:29,679
to say that we've covered and have in

1822
01:08:33,110 --> 01:08:31,040
the archive

1823
01:08:35,189 --> 01:08:33,120
when you stack up a list of the

1824
01:08:36,229 --> 01:08:35,199
cryptozoology shows i think this

1825
01:08:39,669 --> 01:08:36,239
definitely has

1826
01:08:41,430 --> 01:08:39,679
a place in the repertoire merrily's book

1827
01:08:43,910 --> 01:08:41,440
is the quintessential

1828
01:08:46,149 --> 01:08:43,920
book on this topic and patrick has a

1829
01:08:49,590 --> 01:08:46,159
pretty deep knowledge of many esoteric

1830
01:08:51,349 --> 01:08:49,600
and spiritual things alchemy ritual

1831
01:08:52,630 --> 01:08:51,359
the cross-dimensional mechanism of

1832
01:08:55,110 --> 01:08:52,640
exchange

1833
01:08:56,309 --> 01:08:55,120
and i very much appreciated him joining

1834
01:08:59,110 --> 01:08:56,319
us and adding a bit of

1835
01:09:01,430 --> 01:08:59,120
uh flavor to it like most episodes

1836
01:09:03,669 --> 01:09:01,440
around here we laid a good foundation in

1837
01:09:06,390 --> 01:09:03,679
the first hour and got to meander into a

1838
01:09:08,470 --> 01:09:06,400
lot of other topics in the second

1839
01:09:10,709 --> 01:09:08,480
in this one we talked about marylee's

1840
01:09:11,430 --> 01:09:10,719
insights from the sasquatch chronicles

1841
01:09:14,070 --> 01:09:11,440
show

1842
01:09:16,149 --> 01:09:14,080
gramulkin and the notion of accidental

1843
01:09:17,110 --> 01:09:16,159
summoning probably my favorite story of

1844
01:09:20,070 --> 01:09:17,120
the day

1845
01:09:22,070 --> 01:09:20,080
fairy whistling hermes silicon valley

1846
01:09:24,470 --> 01:09:22,080
and roast beef

1847
01:09:26,470 --> 01:09:24,480
the paranormal abilities of patrick and

1848
01:09:29,189 --> 01:09:26,480
marilee's grandmother

1849
01:09:30,950 --> 01:09:29,199
dealings and reciprocal relationships

1850
01:09:33,749 --> 01:09:30,960
with the diamonds

1851
01:09:34,630 --> 01:09:33,759
the food of the gods and the dymonic

1852
01:09:36,470 --> 01:09:34,640
spectrum

1853
01:09:37,910 --> 01:09:36,480
that's out there in the hierarchy you

1854
01:09:40,669 --> 01:09:37,920
could say

1855
01:09:42,149 --> 01:09:40,679
and yes i don't know that diamonds and

1856
01:09:44,149 --> 01:09:42,159
cryptozoology

1857
01:09:46,309 --> 01:09:44,159
are topics that are at the forefront of

1858
01:09:48,229 --> 01:09:46,319
a lot of minds out there right now

1859
01:09:50,789 --> 01:09:48,239
but i don't want to be so obsessed with

1860
01:09:52,709 --> 01:09:50,799
the goings-on inside of human culture

1861
01:09:54,470 --> 01:09:52,719
that we forget that there is a bigger

1862
01:09:56,870 --> 01:09:54,480
game in town

1863
01:09:58,229 --> 01:09:56,880
there is a superstructure that is always

1864
01:09:59,750 --> 01:09:58,239
fascinating beyond

1865
01:10:01,430 --> 01:09:59,760
the narrative of the day or the

1866
01:10:04,950 --> 01:10:01,440
political infighting and the

1867
01:10:06,229 --> 01:10:04,960
virus paranoia it felt kind of important

1868
01:10:09,430 --> 01:10:06,239
to let the thc

1869
01:10:11,350 --> 01:10:09,440
pendulum swing back into that territory

1870
01:10:13,669 --> 01:10:11,360
but be ready because it's about to swing

1871
01:10:15,510 --> 01:10:13,679
back in a big way

1872
01:10:17,910 --> 01:10:15,520
and i'll see you then big thanks to the

1873
01:10:19,990 --> 01:10:17,920
harper siblings for taking the time

1874
01:10:21,430 --> 01:10:20,000
apologies to them for the added

1875
01:10:25,189 --> 01:10:21,440
complexity

1876
01:10:26,709 --> 01:10:25,199
and to you guys for the subpar audio

1877
01:10:29,510 --> 01:10:26,719
i hope it didn't take away from the

1878
01:10:31,990 --> 01:10:29,520
content too much but we do what we can

1879
01:10:33,990 --> 01:10:32,000
i'll see you next time i've done my part

1880
01:10:36,630 --> 01:10:34,000
your move elusive spirits hidden

1881
01:10:38,050 --> 01:10:36,640
energies and demonic companions

1882
01:10:40,390 --> 01:10:38,060
you're

1883
01:10:43,030 --> 01:10:40,400
[Music]

1884
01:10:44,310 --> 01:10:43,040
lucid dreams are so vivid cause you go

1885
01:10:46,709 --> 01:10:44,320
to bed at seven

1886
01:10:48,149 --> 01:10:46,719
and your brain comes alive cause you

1887
01:10:50,790 --> 01:10:48,159
hate your nine to five

1888
01:10:51,990 --> 01:10:50,800
you wake up with a dread and make sure

1889
01:10:54,229 --> 01:10:52,000
your cats are fed

1890
01:10:55,910 --> 01:10:54,239
did your brain talk to a ghost who moved

1891
01:10:59,910 --> 01:10:55,920
your coffee and your toast

1892
01:11:02,630 --> 01:10:59,920
as you listened to the higher side chats

1893
01:11:03,510 --> 01:11:02,640
you get to your desk and your boss says

1894
01:11:06,149 --> 01:11:03,520
it's a mess

1895
01:11:07,350 --> 01:11:06,159
and your soul slowly grows to a place

1896
01:11:09,590 --> 01:11:07,360
where nothing grows

1897
01:11:10,830 --> 01:11:09,600
when you think he's not around you

1898
01:11:14,950 --> 01:11:10,840
insert a seti

1899
01:11:17,350 --> 01:11:14,960
sound the om says turn it down

1900
01:11:19,270 --> 01:11:17,360
and you say it's just the highest side

1901
01:11:22,310 --> 01:11:19,280
chats

1902
01:11:27,030 --> 01:11:22,320
oh do you think you'll be invited

1903
01:11:30,310 --> 01:11:27,040
to bohemia grove to a bilderberg club

1904
01:11:33,229 --> 01:11:30,320
oh do you think you'd be invited

1905
01:11:35,669 --> 01:11:33,239
by a rothschild to a party on a

1906
01:11:40,070 --> 01:11:35,679
submarine

1907
01:11:42,550 --> 01:11:40,080
diving down to the center of the earth

1908
01:11:43,910 --> 01:11:42,560
through the marianas trench your teeth

1909
01:11:46,950 --> 01:11:43,920
begin to clench

1910
01:11:50,950 --> 01:11:46,960
from the sulfurius stench

1911
01:11:55,669 --> 01:11:50,960
the mask you're given doesn't fit

1912
01:11:58,390 --> 01:11:55,679
cause you're not one of them

1913
01:11:59,110 --> 01:11:58,400
starting today you'll make plans to get

1914
01:12:01,510 --> 01:11:59,120
away

1915
01:12:03,030 --> 01:12:01,520
there's no one to hold you down and the

1916
01:12:05,590 --> 01:12:03,040
what if start to drown

1917
01:12:06,870 --> 01:12:05,600
then you wake to the glare of a cold

1918
01:12:09,189 --> 01:12:06,880
fluorescent stare

1919
01:12:10,630 --> 01:12:09,199
and the light winks at you cause it's

1920
01:12:12,709 --> 01:12:10,640
life is almost through

1921
01:12:14,630 --> 01:12:12,719
but it's holding on to quit time just